In his interview with good friend Bryony Gordon, Prince Harry spoke about his concerns for his niece and nephews. He didn’t get super-specific, but he was basically like: the royal system is fundamentally broken and the next generation of heir-and-spares will face similar difficulties. Which is true – it’s not like Harry becoming a generational cycle-breaker suddenly means that the institution will begin to heal. If anything, that heir-and-spare dynamic will become even more entrenched, more abusive, more cut-off from oversight and introspection. Prince William and Kate have already shown everyone that they treat “the heir” differently than the spares. George gets included while Charlotte and Louis are excluded. George gets special gifts, while Charlotte and Louis are ignored. George is already hyped as an artistic genius and a brilliant kid, while Charlotte and Louis are already being assigned their “backup” personalities and roles. Katie Nicholl has some thoughts about this and would you believe? Kate’s hagiographer thinks the kids are perfectly fine.
The Prince and Princess of Wales have ‘it all worked out’ when it comes to navigating Charlotte’s position as ‘spare’, a royal expert has claimed. Speaking to The Telegraph earlier this month, Prince Harry voiced concerns about the future of the other ‘spares’ in the royal family to his brother Prince William – who ‘made it very clear that the children are not his responsibility’.
However Vanity Fair’s Katie Nicholl has said she is sure Prince William and Kate Middleton have it ‘all worked out’ when it comes to Princess Charlotte and her future role in The Firm.
Speaking on the podcast Dynasty, she said: ‘George, Charlotte and Louis are enjoying a childhood Harry and William didn’t get to enjoy and I think that is why William and Kate are channeling everything they can into raising their children with an understanding of who they are as royals but as ordinary children too.’
She explained: ‘No one wants the next generation to suffer as Harry has suffered…it’s not a pretty picture.’
The royal expert said the family were enjoying a childhood which the brothers didn’t, adding: ‘I think when you look to the Cambridges and how they are raising their children, away from the spotlight, in pretty ordinary schools, in a regular cottage on the grounds of Windsor, having bucket and spade holidays and teaching them to sail on the broads in Norfolk….’
‘It does open up the question of the next spare, of Princess Charlotte. I’m sure William and Kate have got that all worked out. Reading Spare, if they do, I think at points it will be deeply uncomfortable for them.’
[From The Daily Mail]
In some sense, Nicholl is correct that the Wales kids’ childhoods are vastly different from Harry and William’s childhoods. Harry and William had parents going to war with each other in the media and at home, and it’s also clear that William always got preferential treatment by everyone (except maybe his mom). Harry and William also grew up without social media and, for part of their childhood, without a mother. I think Kate and the Middletons give the three Wales kids more stability in general, but I would also bet that Carole treats the heir and the spares differently too. And no, I fundamentally do not believe that William and Kate do “have it worked out.” While certain circumstances are different, the system is still f–king dysfunctional. The institution is still broken, abusive and neglectful. 
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179 Responses to “Nicholl: Prince William & Kate ‘have it all worked out’ with their heir & spares”
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In a way, they have worked some things out. William can have his affairs as long as they don’t become “the love of his life” and Kate will put up with it as long as Will doesn’t stab her in the back in public.
The problem with the windsors is that they allow the media and staffers to interfere with what are essentially family affairs. And i don’t see william and kate breaking this circle. The wales children might enjoy a bit more privacy now, but how will that be when they start coming of age? In the time of social media? In any case, i am happy that archie and lilibet aren’t there to be offered up as their cover. Because the way harry and meghan were treated by that institution that was certainly the way it was going to be.
It might be easier on the kids if they come from a more stable base than Will and Harry had.
Also, there seems to be a sense of competitiveness and envy that is generational in the windsor family. Elizabeth vs Margaret
Charles vs Diana (and also andrew)
William vs Harry.
With it being known that kate was quite competitive with her sister too, i wonder what the wales kids are like amongst each other. Maybe it helps that george and charlotte are brother and sister instead of brother and brother or sister and sister.
@Chloe Didn’t Kate say that they were competitive when she visited the wheelchair rugby team?
@Equality All siblings are competitive, especially when they are the same gender, close in age and have similar interests.
@vivian: but in normal families, at a certain age, you outgrow that competitiveness.
@Vivian that is not true – it really depends on the child and the family dynamics – but there is a difference between being a little competitive at sports or something and for that competitiveness to spill over into every little interaction, which is how it seems to be with the Windsors.
But they have broken the ski trip photo wall, which is a good thing and I wonder how they did it. They are totally left alone on all their vacations, it’s a good thing for the kids, but what have they given up in return?
The tragedy was the loss of their mother, not that their parents did not stay together.
@Shazbot I’m not sure why or when that went away. They did release a picture or two from their ski trip several years ago and I remember there being some grumbling from some on the rota because I don’t think they were even told they were going on vacation or something. I wonder if William basically said “I don’t care, we’re not doing that, so you can either take what we do give you or go to hell?”
There is a discussion in either this post or another one about Charles and whether he is trying to correct the mistakes of his childhood. I think William is trying to correct those mistakes, but what he views as mistakes are the extreme press intrusion (okay I’ll give him that one) and his mother’s Bashir interview and his parents divorce.
So he has somehow figured out a way around the press intrusion, but I’m not sure how. I know we say its by dangling access to the kids in front of the RRs, but there still isn’t that much access (and I am not saying there should be more, just does having George at Wimbledon mean that much to the RRs?). Is it a combination of more access to the kids AND letting the press have a field day on Harry and Meghan?
There is all this talk of W&K making deals with the press and all that, but all I can really see of it is the free reign on H&M. Funeral aside, over the past 10 months or so we have seen the kids at Philip’s service, Easter, the Jubbly, George at Wimbledon, Charlotte at the commonwealth games, first day of school, christmas picture, and the christmas walk. I might be missing one or two but overall for almost a year timeframe thats less than one appearance a month, and some of those things were very brief appearances/walks in front of the press (Easter, first day of school, etc).
It’s certainly more than we saw of the kids 5 years ago, but I’m not sure its SO much more that it fits with the idea that the press has backed off the Wales bc now they have so much access to the kids, you know?
anyway just random thoughts as I drink my tea lol.
All the gloom and doom about Harry and William’s childhood. They were not trotted out as much as Kate and Will’s children nor was William blatantly shown to be more special in the PR. Plus. Harry and Will appeared to be having great times at the amusement parks and being with friends like other children do. How is it known that Keen and Bill will automatically have perfect family. Will and Kate could not even sort out that Louis should have been quietly taken backstage when he acted up and better yet, not bring an overtired child to a Jubilee event. And not to mention the way William treated his brother, he apparently thought it was “OK.”
LOL, well, to answer this part of your comment – “How is it known that Keen and Bill will automatically have perfect family.”
It is known because they tell us constantly, lol.
@Becks, seriously. W&K can smugly make all of the predictions they want now; their kids are still young enough that they can essentially make the decisions and call all of the shots. All three are still cute and fairly malleable.
But once those children get older, and their individual personalities emerge more, all bets are off. Absolutely *no way* can W&K control those kids once they’re teenagers, and even before that, the Cambridge kids have access to the internet which gives them the ability to read anything being said (or that was ever printed, for that matter) about their families, a problem that earlier generations never faced. Prior generations of the BRF could brainwash the heir and the spare in peace.
They’re going to make friends that W&K might not like, or have interests their parents don’t approve of, or they might just say “Fck this fishbowl lifestyle, I’m going off to live in privacy in Costa Rica” (or whatever— I have absolutely no idea why that was the first place that came to mind 😂). What if George is gay? Or falls in love with (gasp) a WOC?
I would bet my firstborn that at some point, they’ll all read Spare, once they’re old enough to know how to hide it from their parents. And once they do…well, no one can predict what the fallout will be, but I have to believe there will be some. (Especially if they’re at a particularly rebellious age when they read it.) It may seriously change how they view their parents forever, and permanently damage those relationships.
There are going to be challenges that previous monarchs and heirs never faced, and given what we know, I don’t have much trust in William to be reasonable and compromising when it comes to his children, because he’s never learned to act like that with ANYONE. And I have a feeling that in his mind, they’re his property, not their own people. Kate— who knows where she will even be or what her role will be years from now, or how much the family will try to phase her out as the kids get older.
Anyway, I feel sorry for all three of those children, and truly wish them all the best and hope they grow up as unscathed as possible. But in that family? Yikes.
Huh? Harry says the opposite is true about his childhood.
@tessa: i have to disagree with your first comment. Harry and william were trotted out far more times than the wales children. And if they weren’t trotted out there was a pap following them around. George, charlotte and louis are occasionally papped but far less than harry and william. And as for them being trotted out… well it makes sense for george. He IS the heir and needs to get used to being in public and having camera’s on him, as cruel as it may sound. So far they mostly brought him to events that are kid friendly.
Diana and Charles did have staged photo ops with them. The paparazzi is a different matter. George was caught in a park with a nanny by the paparazzi and unfortunately, I think this will be continued as they get older. And Will and Harry grew up pre Internet and social media so it is a different matter and era. So they did not have to worry about their images on Twitter, et all. George is too young to have to “get used to the public” IMO. The children were brought to a funeral and adult events.
The Wales children are trotted out less because their parents are the least busy royals in modern history. The kids average one pap occasion per month? That is better than their mom’s average. I do think they have a more “normal” childhood than other English royalty has in the past, but when they hit their teen years they may “break free” and show their true colors. I think George will be insufferable like his grandfather and father, but will abdicate if possible (maybe he’ll force himself to fall in love with a Catholic). Charlotte will very much follow in Princess Anne’s wake (wild child teen / young adult, responsible grown up), and Louis? Is the Andrew. His mom’s favorite, the one devoid of any true responsibility, the “trust fund baby” if you will. Louis will be bored and have too much money.
They had fun at amusement parks! Therefore they were a perfectly happy family and no abuse was happening behind the scenes, nope!
That is such a — I’ll be nice and say incredibly naive thing to think.
Like estranged couples, each tried to make the children happy under the circumstances. Harry did say he had an enjoyable childhood and so did William. They were not miserable 24/7 to put it very gently. They also did not live under the same roof after the separation so things may have been somewhat better. It is not naivete it is seeing the glass half full. Their mother died young so they have happy memories about her. Harry also describes how he had therapy and remembered the times with his mother.
Well said, Tessa
@Tessa — Charles absolutely did not try to make Harry happy. He abused him, and encouraged his staff and other son to abuse him too. You can have happy memories of the people who abused you — it’s what makes abuse so difficult to deal with. But glass half full-ing about an abusive situation is a way to cover up for abusers.
Those children are going to suffer the same fate as their parents. W&K might think they have things worked out for them, but they are not taking the press into consideration.
I think it will be a lot worse. Will seems to be a control freak and will criticize and be “upset” at his childrens’ choices of significant others.
Your right Tessa and the signs are already there. George looks shattered all the time, Louis has behaviour problems and WHAT is going on with Charlotte? I don’t know if it’s caught anyone else’s eyes, but why does she always have her fingers crossed? William is a media hog and loves to be shown in a positive light, but it’s becoming harder and Kate? Oh how she loves a photo op, even at prince Phillips funeral she couldn’t resist or at the Queen’s
William has untreated anger issues stemming from the tragic death of his mother. And there are plenty of examples that he gets physical. We don’t know if Kate or the kids have faced the physical anger, but there is no way he hasn’t lost his temper on them.
Kate is also a psychological mess and she has done nothing to stop George from being placed above her other two kids, as Diana tried to do.
Having two parents who are alive does not mean they will have a more stable upbringing.
@Nic also worth pointing out that it seems that Kate is the most important one in her own family. Is that because she was singled out as the one with the best chance of “marrying well” since she was William’s age, or was that always part of how she was raised – the oldest, therefore the most important, full stop. I feel like its sort of a combination of the two things?
But regardless it means that she thinks treating the oldest best is just normal and natural, regardless of proximity to the throne.
@becks1 kate was treated as a golden child similar to William and the fact that the whole Middleton family made catching William’s interest as a family endeavour adds to the whole lack of normalcy of that family. James being depressed despite living a comfortable life is very likely linked to Carole and Mike being not great parents and focusing more on Kate than the rest especially once she got into St Andrews.
Louis and Charlotte don’t really have well adjusted relatives to speak to once they are treated as inferior unless they can speak with Harry or perhaps Eugenie.
Exactly, they phrase “worked things out” sounds like these children are robots not people who might have their own opinions. The parents have worked out how they will control them …good luck
100% agree
Louis will be the new Harry
Charlotte will be the new Elizabeth R but will be married off to some chinless wonder and the papers will delight in her sorrows
I feel incredibly sorry for them
the media then are not letting them be themselves. Charlotte is nothing like the Queen and even looks more like Diana and Carole and was born practically a century after the Queen. She should have a career and be herself. I would like Louis to be like Harry and be strong and protect his family and set about his own path. And not like the “spin” of Harry as depicted by the DM and other outlets.
I admire your optimism, but these kids come from Middleton loins. The personification of a social-climbing dynasty. Kate wouldn’t let her kids stray from the path she and her mother have worked so hard to step upon. If anything, sometimes I think Kate is the one who is most strictest when it comes to her kids.
Charlotte is adorable, but I don’t see any Diana in her face. She seems a blend of Middleton/Windsor. Louie, all Middleton. It’s weird that both she and her brother George are already working royals. And the day they brought out poor Louis in shorts and kneesocks (!)n the middle of winter was really something.
@Ronaldinhio … I think Louis will be the new Andrew (could you ever imagine Harry putting his hand over Diana’s mouth to shut her up)? Kate will forever favor him because he looks most like her/a Middleton and he will be the ‘favorite’ overly indulged child.
@The Duchess
their daughter is going to be the Queen Consort of England. They have arrived, there’s nowhere higher to climb. The only thing they can do now is perhaps marry a royal from another country, so that their blood line is in 2 royal households. But for a blood princess, even that is a lateral move, not a climb. She can easily combine that with a career.
Not to mention that parenting is just tough. Even the best-intentioned parents make mistakes, and neither Khate nor William seem like they would invest the energy that parenting requires. As long as they keep choosing the monarchy they are not choosing their kids.
Unfortunately, we know that the Windsors have a real blind spot when it comes to thinking about the future. Okay, sure, for the sake of argument let’s accept that they have a totally normal, idyllic childhood right now. What about ten years from now? Twenty? What happens when George does or says something stupid like we all did at some point? What happens when George or Charlotte have a partner that the public doesn’t approve of? How is having a “normal” childhood going to prepare them to play the press game / be an unwilling participant in it? Without some kind of change in the invisible contract, it’s all just wishful thinking.
There are hundreds of years of history detailing how bad that family has been with raising kids. Starting from the Hanovers. (And that’s the families who didn’t murder their siblings which was prior to that)
Pretending that somehow this generation will do better is wishful thinking. They have already shown they prioritize their eldest child over the other two for no discernible reason. Neither William or George have a role in the government and so there is zero reason to do this to him.
Except they aren’t at an “ordinary” school and they are in the spotlight. How is having plenty of holidays, preparing them for real life or being ordinary? And, from pictures, Adelaide is not an “ordinary” cottage.
They are from a very wealthy family and will be wealthy adults. They are being raised as ordinary in that context. Adelaide may not be a normal cottage but it isn’t Buckingham palace.
But Adelaide Cottage is recent and they have an apartment at KP, Anmer Hall, and a cottage at Balmoral also. And aren’t there other properties that come with being Duke of Cornwall? Not to mention free run of several palaces whether living there full time or not. So not typical of an ordinary wealthy family either. And even “ordinary” wealthy families don’t holiday as much as W&K.
How? They are being raised just like any other aristocratic children except that their mother might be a little more involved than the queen was since she hardly does any work at all. We have all speculated that Bill doesn’t even live with them and how are we so convinced that they are living full time in this “cottage”? Because they told us so? Lol. I’m sick of pretending they are any different than any other mega rich privileged family. That is the narrative and talking points that the family, press, and RR have been pushing since day one and many people fall for it. They aren’t different and they certainly aren’t ordinary in any sense of the word.
This is all PR because of all of the bad press and how much ordinary citizens are struggling right now so they are feeling a little threatened which means they are sending out that mouthpieces to say, “No, no, don’t worry, we are just an ordinary family like you. We promise we don’t live a “Let them eat cake” lifestyle. Surprisingly a lot of people fall for it.
@equality: let’s not forget the frequent helicopter rides to beat traffic. I don’t know any ordinary family that does that
I’m really sick and tired of their “ordinary ” and “normal” upbringing according the PR.. let’s face it: the only ordinary person they interact with is their nanny and thus their only hope… they’re brought up as special, different from the rest of the peasants… do you really believe that their parents who demand differential treatment from everyone (Easter presents, anyone?) with their rigid behavior and insistence of rules, appearances and protocols (Louis and George wearing shorts in winter, George wearing a suit in a hot day at Wimbledon etc. ) are raising them ordinarily? And as far as the stable family environment is concerned, we don’t really know what goes behind closed doors. We all have our suspicions that they have separated and judging from the tidbits of the media, they both have pretty volatile characters. Not to mention Kate’s obvious mental struggles… the example set by their parents is problematic and unfortunately the apple never falls far from the tree…
An ordinary (prep) school, regular (mansion) cottage, (endless) bucket and spade holidays, teaching them to sail. Yep, just normal average kids lol.
With 24 hour security and a nanny.
Always interesting to watch the press acknowledge that Harry’s memoir has merit ( “No one wants the next generation to suffer as Harry has suffered…it’s not a pretty picture”) when they want to make a point about something, like the impeccable parenting skills of the Waleses.
When the book title was announced months ago they including Katie couldn’t get on the TV fast enough to deny that Harry was treated differently.
I noticed this as well!!
This is exactly what stood out to me as well, Wendy. Every week, there are more and more signs that the invisible contract is dissolving, and the media wants to sing like a canary.
Given that William is so entrenched in the heirachy I have no doubt that George already knows that he more important and is singled out for special treatment than his siblings.
This point is reinforced every time he is trotted out to attend a football match in a suit and tie in a box with world leaders.
Agree wholeheartedly!! And they don’t have any form of “normal” in their lives!! No one has four stately mansions or someone at their beck and call 24/7, like the Cambridge’s have. They also are not shuttled about in helicopters or in luxury vehicles being escorted by police.
Why Nicoll’s is trying to pass them off as “having figured it out” is absurd. You know those children see and hear their parents rows on a regular basis. A father with an alarming anger issues, a mother that is probably in a fit of inconsolable crying added with constantly having to phone her mother, her constant need of cosmetic surgery along with a possible eating disorder. To top it off they trout their children out when the RR’s demand it.
Nicholls isn’t fooling anyone and neither are Bulliam or KKKHate.
Expecting the Heir to understand this problem is ridiculous. Especially William. In my opinion it’d take a lot more self-reflection and willingness to receive criticism than he’s up for.
They aren’t setting the kids up for ‘the family job’; they are tying their children’s self-worth to the order in which they came into this world. One -has- to be more special than everyone else because that’s what a monarch is. And the person in charge of raising these kids is the ‘special’ one, who cannot possibly understand what it’s like to be anything else or why they’d want to.
But that person’s wife is an expert on putting babies in sports or something, so I’m sure it’ll be fine.
Agree. Having the heir and the heir’s wife say they have it all worked out is tone-deaf. It’s the spare’s perspective that matters. And they’ve bullied the spare out of the country and believe he’s brainwashed by therapy. None of that bodes well for having the heir-spare dynamic worked out for their children. They’ve never been the spare so how the hell would they know what that feels like.
This, all day long. Yes, the heir and his wife, in name only since she married a title, are equipped to raise one of their three children. The eldest. That is the beginning and the end of both of their lived experiences. Although, you would think they were both the youngest in their families, with the levels of entitled and lazy.
Yep.
I give Charles credit for trying to fix some of the problems of his childhood. (Not shipping his kids up to northern Scotland to freeze and cry, for starters.) But the fundamental ways the monarchy raises selfish, broken people has not changed.
I genuinely hope Will and Kate make life a little easier for their kids, but Will simply isn’t in a position to make any real changes. His own future depends on it not EVER changing.
Charles in many ways is a worse parent than his own parents. Especially the way he treated Harry, and later Harry’s wife. Charles may be been cold and cried but he treated his first wife horribly and now Harry and Meghan. I don’t give Charles credit, he only made things worse. He put Camilla first always. At least the parents did not let Charles as the heir in effect exile one of his siblings. William has his own dysfunction that unfortunately probably will carry over to his parenting.
Charles didn’t put Camilla first, he put himself first. He was much more interested in his romantic life than the life of his first wife and their children. Charles is a profoundly selfish man who thinks of himself as generous and caring. It’s a combination that allowed him to treat Harry and Meghan as he did not feel the slightest bit of remorse.
I think Charles is a great example. He ‘fixed’ the parts he hated, like the school thing. That was something he understood because it directly and negatively affected his life. But he was incapable of looking outside himself when dealing with his kids’ emotional needs. To a certain extent I think all parents make similar choices and mistakes, just because we’re not perfect. But it should be obvious to everyone that Charles did a bad job. And that being the monarch is a solo job so orienting all your children towards supporting the one who gets to be king is a recipe for perpetuating broken and dysfunctional family dynamics.
Agreeing to not send his children to school in Scotland was about it. I can’t help but compare how Andrew always advocated and made sure his children were treated with the respect he left was due to them as grandchildren of the monarch versus how Charles allowed staff to treat Harry, the son of a future monarch. Eugenie and Beatrice had a four bedroom apartment in St. James Palace while Harry was living in a basement somewhere or that small cottage. I bet no staff person would dare go to the queen to complain about Andrew’s children.
Will Charlotte have a say in her own life? It sounds like William gets to decide, and what happens to Charlotte if her plans differ from her father’s. He will probably go after her the same way his gone after Harry. It doesn’t sound like they’re raising Charlotte to have a life outside of the monarchy which is what they need to do. My money is on Charlotte writing her memoir one day picking up where uncle Harry left off to show how the dysfunction of that family continued.
I think the relationship between Wills and George is much like an abused child has with his abuser/parent. When George and Kate met Wills at Wimbledon last year there was video of Wills arriving separately and greeting some of the Wimbledon folks who were standing there with Kate and George. When Wills came to George it was so awkward. It seemed like they hadn’t seen each other in awhile and I think George put out his hand to shake his dad’s hand. I thought if he hadn’t seen him for awhile you’d think he’d hug him and if he just saw him at breakfast that morning he’d smile and say hi Dad. He rarely smiles when he is walking with Wills. Looks like he is terrified of him.
Not Kate’s hagiographer! 😂😂😂 They are so unserious even when it comes to their children.
So two things:
1) they can’t have it all “worked out” and have plans to treat them differently than William and Harry were treated without W&K acknowledging that the way William and Harry were raised was effed up, you know? If William is going to say “hey i’m going to raise my kids differently than the way I was raised” then the next part of that is “because the way I was raised and the disparity in treatment between Harry and me and the heir vs spare dynamic is messed up and toxic.” And I just don’t think William thinks it was/is. If he did, he would be much more understanding of Harry’s decision to walk away.
2) We’ve talked on here before about how the dynamic will play out given the different sibling set up with the Wales children, and that may be what kind of saves them. Charlotte is technically the spare; will she be treated as such or will Louis be “the spare” in the eyes of the press? George is the heir, Charlotte is the princess, and Louis is….well, Louis. So will he end up getting the spare treatment, or will Charlotte?
Also can we take a minute to laugh at her description of their vacations?? Are we really just pretending this family didn’t go to Jordan last year and they don’t go skiing in the alps every year and Mustique isn’t Kate’s favorite holiday destination?
Interesting idea. 3 kids rather than 2 could mean that the two spares can possibly bond together as spares or at least disperse some of the negativity. I’d like to think that these kids will be alright. The whole system is just so twisted and competitive though and nothing is ever as it seems. Family members who should be friends and have each other’s backs end up competing over who gets sacrificed in the press. Would love to see that cycle broken.
The main difference is that the wales kids haven’t lost their mother at a young age, which is hugely traumatic and requires therapy that William never received.
Otherwise William and Kate are both massively dysfunctional adults with major untreated psychological issues in a dysfunctional environment that perpetuates generational trauma and pits one child against the order based on birth order.
There is no way these kids get a functional upbringing unless the parents get significant treatment and make real changes about the sinister hierarchy set up within the family as well as the institution.
And the Middletons are just as bad because they crave to be a part of this dysfunctional system and they will not provide any normalcy for these kids.
And living with parents who are separated but acting otherwise in public will only add to everything.
Word.
Every single part of England’s system needs to recognize they have tossed all of their eggs in a basket that they don’t like, or want to pretend like they bow and curtsy to. I don’t even care that my high school English teacher is murdering me with her eyeballs, and red pen, for how I ended that sentence.
Game on, England. Peace be with you, blah, blah, blah.
Nicholl does not know what she is talking about. On the surface there is nothing so different about their childhoods up until this point, other than William and Harry went to boarding school. They are all trapped in the system and in a fish bowl. Harry said he had a very happy childhood and loads of fun. Nicholl does not know what it is like inside Kate and Will’s marriage and how much of that has seeped into the children’s lives. She really just makes everything up.
Charlotte and Louis will grow up to be jealous of Archie and Lili once they realize Archie and Lili are free to do whatever they want and don’t have to show up to all these ridiculous and stuffy royal events. I have no idea how Kate and William are navigating Harry and William’s rift and how they explain that to the kids. But they will start asking questions at some point and want to know about their uncle Harry and aunt Meghan and their cousins. And how are they going to explain that their American cousins can do whatever they want whenever they want? Not to mention Pippa’s kids are right there in the UK and the Wales kids will be able to immediately see their cousins are free to live the lives they want. Charlotte and Louis will eventually resent George’s position as heir, if not completely resent George. Royal siblings used to plot murder to usurp the heir back in the day. While that doesn’t happen anymore, the hierarchy still exists and that creates dysfunction for everyone. Kate and William want to pretend they are above the dysfunction but they aren’t, they’re right in the middle of it and their kids will suffer as a result just like William and Harry did.
You should be just as concerned for Harry’s children when they find out they have a grandfather, aunts, uncles and loads of cousins in the UK. Those kids are in for a less colorful life without any extended family.
Lol Vivian. I suppose you forgot when Meghan and Archie were completely ignored by Kate and the two of her children old enough to understand her edicts. Or when Archie’s grandfather did nothing when he was compared to a chimp, or when Charles and William sanctioned article after article about how “disrespectful” Lili’s name was, and the “concerns” about their children’s skin. Do you even read what you write?
First, the part about having a less colorful life without extended family is not true. Loads of people I know have very little extended family and have had lives that are just fine. Lots of these people also have family friends who took up the roles that cousins, aunts, and uncles might play. I myself have a huge extended family (over 40 cousins on one side!) but my parents didn’t live that close to them. Other than one set of cousins, I grew up with family friends whose members filled those roles for me. I can report that my life growing up was as colorful or mores than most.
Second, H&M’s kids will have contact with some of their extended family, just not all of them. And as someone who also had toxic relatives, their inclusion in your life is not exactly a good thing. Take my maternal grandfather (when he died, people went to his funeral just to make sure the rat b****** was dead, no joke). Our lives improved tremendously once my mother gave up trying to have a relationship with him. I don’t think H&M or their kids will benefit from a relationship with more than a few of the Windsors, so their lack of presence in their lives isn’t exactly a loss. Who needs a cold, self-centered grandfather who abuses and gaslights your parents around? How on earth would Archie and Lily benefit from a relationship with Snarles when he’s incapable of forming normal relationships?
Did you actually just say their life would be “less colorful” because they’re in California and not near the White family members who helped bully their parents away? Awkward choice of words.
Look, it’s a shame that they can’t live closer to their cousins. But they can’t. They are not safe in that country and the Monarchy won’t keep them safe. They will live in a diverse, vibrant place, make plenty of friends, have loving parents and more than enough financial security, and be free to choose their own paths.
They will have a rich life.
Less colorful? Lol, does Andrew provide the color? Presumably, there are cousins that Harry would like Archie and Lili to know. But, there’s also something called found family and we don’t know that the Sussex children won’t have that. In fact, I’m sure they will.
Less colorful? What? I grew up without much contact with my dad’s family simply because they lived in another country and we only got to see them once a year in the summer. Do I wish I could have seen them more growing up? Sure, but it didn’t impact my emotional development in any way and I was just fine growing up.
Meghan herself grew up as a child of divorce and without a lot of immediate family. She is doing just fine without her trashy older half siblings. (Her dad is another story). The Sussexes have lots of friends with kids close in age to theirs. They are doing just fine. The BRF has such complicated and dysfunctional relationships, Meghan and Harry are doing their kids a huge favor by raising them out of that bubble.
They have a grandfather and uncle in another country who disregarded their father and mother so much that they literally did not care whether they lived or died and pulled security after leaking their location.
These kids will have an extended family. It might not be through blood, but they’ll have an extended family.
Acting like blood ties trump all can be very very damaging.
Vivian, when I see someone comment as you do, I wonder why anyone would want the Sussex children to be used as metaphorical punching bags for the Wails children. They would be used as the scapegoats just as Harry was, except racism will be included. Why would anyone want that to be part of their childhood/lives?
Granddad could have flown over to see his grandchildren. Eugenie and h
Jack managed to visit.
“Less colourful life”?? The Sussex kids would be treated like the black sheep of the family. Lest we forget the Wails’s kids are A) Being brought up by parents who clearly loathe each other and live apart most of the time; and B) Inculcated with the same generational issues that haunted Harry and made Meghan suicidal, and both had therapy for the trauma they sustained whilst in the royal fold. They will actually have a more colourful life in California with parents who visibly and proudly display the love they have for each other and their children, who are deeply involved with public service and inclusivity, and will do their damndest to raise their kids to be kind, giving, and charitable instead of turning them into spoiled, elitest, racist little snots.
Archie and Lili will be able to read the book their father wrote and they will have a great understanding of what he did to protect them. Kids understand early on when certain relatives are poison and the Sussex kids will not have to worry about being placed below their cousins due to a stupid system.
They will end up pitying their cousins trapped in that mess because there is no way Charlotte and Louis escape the spare treatment. Edward to this day is still stuck worrying if he gets a title from his brother.
You made me laugh, I’ll give you that.
Since when have the Waleses expressed any affection for the Sussex children? I remember Peggington’s flippant “I already have a nephew” comment when Prince Archie was born. And I remember the photos of how deliberately Kkkhate went out of her way to ignore Meghan and newborn Archie at the polo match. And the Wales made sure the media was briefed about how delighted Will and Kkkhate were to snub Princess Lilibet’s birthday party.
So miss me with that crap about raising the kids around loving cousins. Their Black blood means the Wales kids are being taught to despise them and see them as beneath them.
Why expose innocent children to bigots, even if the bigots are relatives?
Those kids are called Archie and LILLIBET and those kids will be so grateful to their parents when they realise that their lives are happy, free and full of love, compared to the bear pit filled with petty jealousies and sheer bloody nastiness that they kept them away from
I doubt Charlotte and Louis will be jealous of Archie and Lilibet. They will have very little connection with them, just people they see at family funerals. I have a bunch of cousins and as I go about my daily life I don’t give them a thought, and I bet it’s the same with them. Neither will Archie and Lili wonder what’s going on with Louis or Charlotte or George.
Why do we have different expectations of these people than what we experience in our own lives?
Regular people don’t have their cousins covered by a nation’s media.
I worry about all children born into the world as it is. The Royal Fishbowl has its own special challenges. I fear for them all but in truth I don’t know them. Charlotte seems resilient and Louis seems to be full of beans, but that may not be true. Only time will tell. I wish them all well, and wish them all to do better than their parents did, swimming in that fishbowl with all those pirhanas.
Charlotte will be just fine. She won’t be known as the spare, but as the only daughter and future Princess Royal. She appears to ” get it”, takes the leadership position over her older brother and appears to have a maturity level better than most her age. It is Louis that they should be worried about. He’s a real little firecracker.
This is exactly the problem we’re talking about. The children have already been assigned “roles” and personality traits based on what has happened in front of the cameras. They are trapped.
I hope that will be the case, but as the only girl, she’s going to have attention on her appearance and probably scrutiny of her personal life that the boys won’t face. That’s bad in its own way.
I’m sorry but why would you assume that charlotte will be fine? I mean I hope so but the BM is grotesquely misogynistic and even a princess will not be immune. I genuinely shudder at how they will write about charlotte as she ages up. Seemingly benign articles will drip with deeply uncomfortable connotations, regardless of how she seems to “get it” and her being a princess royal. She will not be spared from the BM and the entrenched misogyny. No, she won’t get Meghan levels but she will get sexist commentary. There’s no amount of “getting it” that can prepare someone for that.
Charlotte will be fine. They will throw Lili under the bus to protect her. This is one of the sooo many reasons why Harry should mind his business and worry about Archie and Lili instead of worrying about those three kids that everyone will protect them at the expense of his own kids.
None of the Cambridge children (that we know of) are going to be fine growing up royal. They’ve been proving that for over 100 years.
Charlotte will be fine because she will be the only (acknowledged) Princess of her generation. There are no more princesses unless George and Louis have daughters.
Louis is the one who will get tossed under the bus. William never wanted to have him anyway and I actually don’t think William will want to serve Charlotte up as much as he and his dad served Harry up. He will (IMO) serve Louis up. So even though Charlotte is the technical Spare, it’s Louis who will get the Spare treatment.
She’s 7.
Lots of people thought Harry was fine until he said otherwise. Until she becomes an adult, we will have no idea how she is coping until she speaks at that time.
They are little children. Children about whom we don’t actually know anything. And I don’t think Charlotte will be “fine” unless Will and Kate throw everything they have at protecting her, considering the massive misogyny of the English press. They are rubbing their hands with glee, waiting until she hits puberty to tear her to bits.
Kate needs to be the center of attention, particularly with other females around. I don’t see her doing well when attention shifts to Charlotte, as it naturally will, when she gets older. She’s almost 8; in 5 years she’ll be 13, just entering her teen years, while Kate will be on the far side of 45. I bet there will be trouble for Charlotte in this situation, with Kate as her mother. After all, jealousy is the Windsor/Middleton way.
The Cambridge kids definitely have had a more stable upbringing than both William & Harry, and indeed Charles managed. It’s probably closer to what the late Queen had – relatively secluded and a tight family unit. But that didn’t really help Princess Margaret, who ended up with the same “Spare” dynamic.
It’ll be different for Charlotte and Louis, who’ll get the proper education that Margaret so resented missing out on. But it doesn’t solve the problem of what happens if they don’t fit the mould the media expects them sit in. That’s where they’ll have a challenge – when George is human and screws up, do they say “guess what, he’s human, so are we, don’t like it? Tough.” Or do they feed a “Charlotte/Louis is the royal rascal” story to the press?
I would not say for certain that the Wales children have a more stable upbringing. It is IMO too soon to tell.The spin is that they are the “ideal” family, and this is the facade of the family. How they get along every day is impossible to say. I think in many ways Will and Harry had a more stable upbringing, despite it all, Charles and Diana both had decided not to treat the heir as more “special.” And there were no photos of William being singled out to get gifts (exception was when the Queen Mother doted on William and ignored Harry). The images of George being singled out to take to games and getting gifts to me could mean trouble in the family dynamic down the road. The “instability” potentially with the Wales comes with the way Harry and Meghan were treated. How the children will react to that in future?
I was going to say that the more accurate comparison of the spare dynamic for the Wales’ kids is to the queen and her sister. Margaret never really got over not being able to marry who she wished. And, as a child, her father being aware of the thankless position of the spare (he himself was one), spoiled her terribly. Even in the most stable home, and W&K allegedly have their share of problems, it is truly toxic to treat one child as more important and more valuable than the others. And it only gets worse as they get older.
Given Bill’s reported temper, I’m not so sure the Wales’ kids are having a more stable upbringing than past generations. Different, yes. But a parent who thinks it’s ok to physically assault their uncle? How does he act at home? His temper has to impact their lives too.
Just because their parents aren’t divorced doesn’t mean it’s more stable. Harry has already mentioned William’s anger issues.
And parents who stay together for the sake of the kids end up making everything worse. Especially when it’s to preserve a public facade.
All these reporters are forgetting social media. Do none of them realize that very soon. Especially for George. That the kids classmates and friends are going to have camera phones. I’m sure the royal family are trying to not allow that to happen. But it is going to happen. And all the things that George gets up to is going to be documented. Whatever William and Kate try to do about it. And without Harry & Meaghan to throw under the bus. The tabloids are going to be extreme about it. For the clicks. How’s that going to look for Kate being a good mother.
I feel for these kids. They had no choice in being born into this family or in what order. And you’re right, George is already being singled out. Besides, Louis is aging out of the early years which means his mother will have no knowledge base to work from, right? lol
And I love that picture of Charlotte between her parents. She looks so embarrassed at the guffaws coming from William’s wife.
TOTALLY NORMAL CHILDHOOD! except for the time George warned his friend that he’d better watch out because George’s dad will be king …
Sorry, the display at the Jubilee parade debunks this. The Wales have shown time and time again that they really prioritize how things look, rather than how it feels to use Harry and Meghan’s term. All their cousins were moving around and playing with each other not sitting in the “good seats” in the front row. George, Charlotte and Louis had to stay in their priority seats and not mix. When W&H were growing up they didn’t stay with their family during balcony appearances according to rank, they hung out with their cousins. Rank is definitely important in the Wales’ home and they all know their place, except maybe Louis, but I am sure we will learn soon.
I think Kate Nichols is projecting, I doubt anyone is discussing the children with her, it’s just more perfect parents will and Kate they’re just like us propaganda. What she doesn’t seem to realise or is deliberately leaving out, is that it’s not just up to William and Kate. If the media need tension they will create it. Also it’s hilarious how Katie leaves out the holidays to the private island of mustique on the duke of Westminster’s private jet, the holidays to courcheval and Jordan. Or that lambrook isn’t a normal school. It’s an extremely expensive one with many acres of grounds. Also George is already aware of his status, separated at the Christmas cake photo op, having reportedly told another kid at school about his dad being the future king so…
In the midst of all this I do actually sorry for Harry and Meghan sometimes. The media clearly want one of them unalive. Also, their war with murdoch and rothermere will likely continue all through their kids formative years, kids murdoch press already don’t see as human. I’m glad it looks like from the documentary they do get to have a pretty normal life. But once they’re out and about… they aren’t going to treat them like they do Edward and Sophie’s kids. They’re going to intrude on their school life FOR SURE.
I would just like to say that all of these photos stream dysfunctional family, especially the balcony one
The picture of charlotte on the beach between her parents really stood out to me. Her face says over it while Kate does her gigantic fake laugh. I’m uncomfortable just seeing that fake laugh in photos. Imagine sitting next to it when you know from real experience that it’s not genuine.
Bench*
Scream not stream..
On the plus side, both parents are still alive and not openly warring with each other in the media. There doesn’t seem to be a Camilla in William’s life either. Just a bunch of shallow affairs (except Rose??)
William is DEEPLY emotionally invested in at least keeping the facade of a happy marriage/family. I bet you to this day he remains angry at Diana at not sucking it up and taking Charles’ adulterous ways because he believes if she did, she would still be alive.
That said, those kids are being raised in a household with a rage monster father and an eating disordered mean girl. They have probably witnessed and overheard knock down drag out fights between their parents. George and Louis are learning how to be disrespectful to women like Pa and Charlotte is probably already obsessing over her weight like Mummy.
They’ll probably develop panic disorders from being trotted out regularly like zoo animals to the public and the press. And sadly have no idea that their characters are already being developed by the press before they even have a chance to figure out who they are themselves.
Yeah, it’s going GREAT.
William could still meet a “Camilla”. It was not only Charles behavior re: Camilla, he was witnessed being emotionally abusive with public putdowns. As early as 1983 he pronounced, with his wife sitting next to him, that he needed two wives–this at a public banquet, Diana cringed. Diana was made of sterner stuff than Kate and did not put up with it and eventually left.
Harry didn’t complain about not having enough time to run around outdoors and play! That’s one of the few things about his childhood that sounded pretty good. So it’s not like learning to sail or playing on the beach is going to counter that for the Cambridge kids.
I do hope that the Cambridges consider their kids’ academic abilities when choosing schools for them later on, but that is later on, so who knows how that will go?
That pic with the little squirt’s hand over his mum’s mouth is so oddly satisfying lol. I can say my boys never did that as toddlers. Hushing up mommy? Um no.
@Kaiser said:
“In some sense, Nicholl is correct that the Wales kids’ childhoods are vastly different from Harry and William’s childhoods. Harry and William had parents going to war with each other in the media and at home….”
…………………………………………………………………………….
Um…… No…uh. The War of the Wales Part Deux is on like Donkey Kong! Their sycophants/co-conspirators in the britshidtmedia have been hinting at the loud drag-out fights these two have been having from within the first 5 years of their marriage. And its only gotten worse.
We’ve seen the infamous pointed finger wth a glimpse of the red angry face of BullyBoyWilly with the simultaneous cowering face of kkkHATE. And we’re told that “she gives as much as she gets” behind closed doors during their “screaming matches.”
We’ve also seen kkkHATE’s physical deterioration right before our eyes. The only thing we’ve NOT been told by the sycophants is that he’s physically abusive to her. And thats because they wouldnt dare!
HOWEVER, we can only surmise, given what we’ve learned in H’s memoir, Spare, that BullyBoyWilly is not averse to hitting women. Remember, he dragged his sorry arse over to the Sussex’s house, in anger, demanding to see M, only to learn she was in NY at the time. WHAT, pray tell, did that sorry excuse of a man have in mind, given that he took his frustration and anger out on H instead.
So yeah, the cambrats have been seeing their parents go at each other, just as BullyBoyWilly and H saw with their parents. Have you not seen the cowed look on the faces of those poor little mites?
Did you actually read the book? He did not go to the Sussex’s house “demanding” to see Meghan. He only wanted to talk to Harry. —
“ Willy asked for a meeting. He wanted to talk about everything, the whole rolling catastrophe. Just him and me, he said. As it happened, Meg was out of town, visiting girlfriends, so his timing was perfect. I invited him over.” — That’s what Harry said in his book
William also demanded that Harry “not tell Meg” about the altercation and she only found out when she saw his bruised and cut back while getting out of the shower.
It’s clear the Wails have a very caustic marriage. This is a dangerous environment in which to raise kids as it will habituate them to the idea that fighting, yelling and stony silences are the norm. The fact that their parents live apart much of the time must also be damaging — they don’t have good role models as parents and I predict those kids are going to be more than a handful as they grow up.
We just don’t know. Maybe the Wails home life is as wholesome as it looks. Maybe William and Keen fight all the time, maybe William rages, maybe they know they have to hide that dad doesn’t always live with them, maybe Keen spends her days exercising (or whatever one does to remain severely underweight).
Their home life could be perfect but every time the children appear in public as part of their parents’ engagements, every time George is placed in a head of state box with adults, every time their first day of the school year is filmed and distributed to the worldwide media, the ability to limit that media access and attention later is diminished just a bit more. William and Kate understood this 10 years ago and stood ready to battle both the press and courtiers. Something changed.
If the Wails’ home life is “as wholesome as it looks,” it’s as wholesome as a three-decker sauerkraut and toadstool sandwich with arsenic sauce. The mother has a severe eating disorder, the father has massive rage issues, they clearly hate each other, and they parade the children around to cover for it. That’s just what we know.
💯🤣😂
There’s another member of their family that the Waleses haven’t considered. The British media. The British media will expect to play a role in the upbringing of those kids. They will voice their disapproval of anything those kids do that don’t go according to script. The people the kids date, what they study at school, what hobbies they have, will be scrutinized and judged by the media. If the Windsors love is transactional and conditional, the media’s affection and approval is even worse. Kate only has media approval because they had someone else to hate instead of her. The media has Kate on a short rope–she’s acceptable as long as she remains slender and silent.
If those kids have their own voices, interests that extend beyond the narrow range of what’s acceptable (horses, country pursuits, the “right” sports), they will be fed to the wolves. If Charlotte is anything other than thin and pretty, her appearance will be judged mercilessly. If Louis is smarter or more charismatic than George, he will be forced to make himself lesser.
Social media will make their lives so much worse. Very soon, their friends, their dates, will be subject to scrutiny that’s even worse than what Harry experienced. Those ratchets will give opinions on the kids mistakes, poor performances, awkwardness. It will be even worse if the kids are talented–then they will be expected to excel at all costs.
My guess is that the Wales will cloister those kids and only expose them to upper class norms and opportunities, for all their talk about “normal kids.” At some point, the spotlight will be on the kids instead of their parents, and they have 2 parents who are prone to jealousy. Generational trauma continues. Which is exactly what the media wants–the Wales children aren’t people. They are performing hamsters who exist for the entertainment of the British public. They refuse their assigned roles at their peril.
The royals are in serious trouble. George is a cute kid, but it doesn’t look to me like he is going to get his father “child actor” good looks so good luck finding a suitable bride smitten enough to be willing to date an heir on the down low and let the paps sift through her dirty laundry like raccoons.
The other two have it even worse since they have no power or leverage, and the palace will be more than happy to trash their relationships if it will make the heir seem like the pick of the litter.
It would serve the racists right if the crown gets passed to the Sussexes if the Cambridges refuse to breed in captivity.
Your last sentence, @monlette, but me between the eyes! What happens if George, Charlotte and Louis all do not reproduce or have no living children? Would Archies’ first child be first in line?
The line goes to Harry and then Archie and Lili if the Wales kids don’t have any kids of their own.
Unless Charles somehow removes Harry, but it’s doubtful he will go that far. And if not Harry’s line then it goes to Andrew, so that is a worse option and unlikely why Charles is not messing with the line of succession.
Charles can’t mess with the line of succession. He doesn’t have that power. It would have to go through Parliament.
Its a fantastical fantasy to fantasize about H&M’s kids going anywhere near that poisoned chalice cult known as the BRF. Even if the entire cambridge/wales clan were to………become incapable/unable/unavailable (I do hope you recognize and appreciate all these pseudonyms) for whatever reason, it is my belief that H&M, as well as A and L themselves, will reject that cult in favor of the authentic life H&M will have created for themselves and their, by then, adult children
If that means immediate extraction of H and his heirs from the line of succession, given that H&M back in 2020 offered the BRF the opportunity to go ahead and take their titles and the cowards refused, then clearly, being removed from the line of succession will have no meaning to H&M and their kids.
Monlette, I don’t think we have to worry about Charlotte “breeding in captivity”. Wails will make sure she knows that it’s her duty to have children.
Well, at least this reporter is acknowledging Harry’s trauma. But she’s kidding herself otherwise.
William and Kate are ALL about appearances. On the balcony for the Jubbly flyover, George, Charlotte and Louis all should have been wearing ear protectors — but those might have spoiled the photos.
Poor little Louis should have been wearing long trousers for the Christmas Day church walk — but his parents had him in shorts and knee socks, because that’s what royal sons traditionally wore. On the same walk, Kate was wearing a hat and leather gloves, while her kids went hatless and gloveless.
George was forced to swelter in a suit at the Wimbledon’s men’s final, in a freaking heat wave.
William and Kate have figured out NOTHING. They will sacrifice their children to the monarchy and to a falsified image of the monarchy, just as Charles did.
We don’t REALLY know what goes on behind the scenes in Kate and William’s home and with their children. But @QuiteContrary your point about appearances is spot on. When they bring the kids out, I see a Mom and Dad who have children inappropriately dressed for the weather–bare knees on a cold winter day; no gloves/hats or scarves and George sweltering at Wimbledon with no breaks. We see kids forced to sit through events that are not age-appropriate. I still maintain that Charlotte and George were too young for the whole day funeral of QEII and Louis was too young for that stupid Jubbly concert. We see Louis disrespecting his mother putting his hand on her mouth, and shaking his finger in her face (at least the mystery of where he learned that has been solved thanks to SPARE.) We don’t see the mom and dad interacting happily with each other while a family unit; the cold stares, separate arrivals, and space between them is now commonplace. We don’t see the family acting very happy and relaxed TOGETHER at all. So no, I don’t think the Wails have this family life in the bag and are doing it any better than Chuck and Di.
There is a photo of them on the balcony from the jubbly where the whole family looks miserable, even the kids. And this is where they knew they had to put on a show for the public and even that facade could not be maintained for the full fifteen minute balcony appearance (it might even have been shorter since the Queen was clearly not doing well then)
The media know things are not “okay” behind the scenes with them but they will cover for them as long as there is more given to trash H and M. Eventually that will dry out.
So what’s the plan: when Louis gets bad press to cover for George, W&K will say “but remember when we took you to the beach”?
Exactly. Or when his wedding must be planned around his brother and father’s schedule of public appearances. Or when he and his spouse want a small private wedding but there’s a recession and his partners have recently received some bad press. Or when his brother is shy and not a natural at public appearances and goes inward and he is asked to do a public appearance because someone in the family must provide a photograph that day. Or the first time he moons his classmates as his mother allegedly did and the papers extort his parents and grandparents over it. Etc etc
Remember one of William’s comments before the summit, explaining why he was a part of it, in relation to his children.
The second comment was one of many regarding Harry the ‘spare’ to the sad little man.
William spoke of establishing conditions to ensure that the spare will not see themself as an equal.
In terms of stability, why does one of the children seem tense when they are trotted out to fulfil their contract with their media establishment?
An unhappy home environment is less emotional healthy than two separate existences due to divorce.
Less tension, friction and shouting….
At Christmas George was dressed as a mini-William.
A stark contrast to his siblings.
Despite the aspirations expressed in the fail, I suppose it seem like Louis.
I sincerely hope that I am wrong, and am misreading the obvious signs.
But some one has to suffer the pain of being lied about and be deliberately misunderstood to “create royalty in captivity”.
And by trotting the children out regularly, they are already setting an expectation with the British press and British public that the children are public figures with an exalted public role. That is not a genie that is easily put back in the bottle, and the Sussexes will not continue 5 years from now or even a decade from now to be daily news fodder. It is just an inevitability that the Wales will either feed the machine or fight it.
Kids are already overexposed so there is nothing to see
Obviously, it was a code orange alarm at Middleton manor at this line: his brother Prince William – who ‘made it very clear that the children are not his responsibility’.
Forget the heir and the spare dynamic – this article is all about trying to reinforce that the Cambridges are both involved in the parenting decisions (as opposed to Kate, her mother, and an army of nannies). Why, they even take their children on holidays! Together! Imagine that.
And the Middletons rallied around Kate because it *benefitted them directly.* James Middleton’s cake business got a full Tatler spread when he was not even 25. Pippa was interviewed by the telegraph before the wedding AND before her own forays into journalism etc. There’s no doubt party pieces got more attention. William helped buy the house the Middletons live in. There’s an endless list of things that the “spares” were given to assuage their fate – even Margaret. She was allowed to accept the The house on Mustique. Money to renovate it etc. What has gone on since the 90s is that the spares are expected to portray themselves as paupers and not “trade on their position.” Yet Harry seems to be the only one who took that seriously and was still criticized for it
God those pics of Keen with her mouth wide open fake laugh. Kind of understand Louis hand over her mouth a little better.
Unless William is willing to take on the British press when his children are teens and adults, none of this can be true. The destiny for Charlotte and Louis is very simple. they can become full time working members of the royal family and face a lifetime of public scrutiny and battles over the purse strings and housing and security. Or they enter the a cloistered infantalized “workforce” a la James Middleton. Or they enter the kind of employment for a certain kind of rich woman like Eugenie (and face a certain level of criticism for using their titles and connections). Or they attempt to enter into the other kind of employment available to rich kids with connections everywhere – commercial real estate, high end residential real estate, hedge funder (almost definitely would require too much work), real estate developer, and face endless accusations of using their titles, connections, etc. Royal observers and reporters of the non sycophantic variety felt that insistence on refusing to entertain any real option for Harry and Meghan was a missed opportunity to set a precedent now and get the public now used to working royal heirs. If they are preparing this kids to enter a modern workforce, even a highly connected one, then they will absolutely have to battle the media over it. If they aren’t, then we are in for more of the same.
Ditto.
By the time they are adults people might not care about the whole royal circus anymore, they may be lucky and just live quiet luxurious lives.
The Wales’ kids will have their dating lives scrutized more thanks to social media. Plus classmates can bully them by putting up compromising pictures of them on their pages.
This whole paragraph is hilarious:
“The royal expert said the family were enjoying a childhood which the brothers didn’t, adding: ‘I think when you look to the Cambridges and how they are raising their children, away from the spotlight, in pretty ordinary schools, in a regular cottage on the grounds of Windsor, having bucket and spade holidays and teaching them to sail on the broads in Norfolk….”
“pretty ordinary schools?” “regular cottage?” “grounds of Windsor?” “teaching them to sail?” None of these details depict ordinary. Very aristocratic at the very least- so is her point that they are being raised as ordinary aristocrats rather than royals? I think Diana was very aware of her son’s positions. She didn’t try to raise them as “ordinary” but tried to give them experiences that many “ordinary” people had so that they could relate to people outside of their rarefied and incestuous circle. It seems to me that William and Harry made a lot of public appearances when they were children.
They don’t have it worked out. How could they? They have stated no specific changes regarding their children’s treatment in public. And they are clearly still preferentially treat George since he was little. This is toxic for all their children’s development and self-worth.
Plus there is social media fully established now. Not only will they suffer at the hands of school yard abusers, but anonymous people everywhere. They should never touch social media, until they are strong adults. Otherwise it could be their undoing.
They are a mess, and unless they enforce boundaries now, it will be will and Harry 2.0. Little pitchers have big ears. They will know what their father does to Harry and what the Sr. Royals do to everyone else. Even if they have no social media, rhey can still read online the fakakta present.
Of course these kids would have a much happier childhood than William and Harry, there’s no comparison, they may grow up alright if their parents keep it together
I don’t t hink anybody has a perfect childhood. William and Harry were happy as children and there are photos to prove it. Diana would take them to theme parks and they had lots of friends. William and Harry also spent time with their cousins on both sides of the family. If the parents stay together but there is some acrimony, it would not be good either. The tragedy was losing their mother. I think had she lived they would have been raised with shared custody which does happen in families.
Lee, what is your definition of the parents keeping it together? The parents can’t keep it together enough in public to try and look like they like each other. Do you think that goes away when they’re out of the public eye? Let’s not create a fairytale here.
She doesn’t know how those kids are being raised anymore than we do. Are they being raised to think they are “better” than other people because of their blood? My guess is yes, although we don’t know for sure. Are they being raised to accept that George is inherently more important than the other two? My guess is yes. Are they being raised to believe the wife’s role is to turn a blind eye to her husband’s cheating? My guess is yes. Are they being raised to accept racism and find it amusing? My guess is yes. Are they being raised to accept that the heir can be an incandescent rage monsters and nobody can tell him “no”? My guess is yes. All of that is more important than what house they live in, or where they go on vacation. But we don’t have insight into all that, so nobody can say they are good or bad parents, although based on what little we do know of them, again, my guess is “yes” to all of that.
Are W&K allowed to stay out of public with the kids until coronation day?
I think it would be a good idea.
Then, get W&K some actual work but leave the kids out of it.
KCIII would be very wise to make a large donation from his personal wealth, I think $4M is a good number, to be divided to several longstanding proven charities helping UK.
Put out a quick official statement, and then shut up and stay out of the public eye for at min. 3 months. Silence, no planting garbage in the media, no plotting against H or M.
Go away.
4 million dollars is less than pocket change for them. It’s nothing. Try 400 million and then we’re getting somewhere.
@Isabelle
Here is a picture of the Queen mum as a child. Princess Charlotte is very much like her IMO. & Less Middleton-like.
https://www.historyofroyalwomen.com/elizabeth-bowes-lyon-2/elizabeth-bowes-lyon-from-lady-to-duchess/
If anything, Eugénie is a dead ringer for her. Charlotte resembles her father more at her age.
Charlotte’s squinty eyes look nothing like that side
I think Eugenie is the one who looks most like the Queen Mother. I see more of a resemblance to the Middleton side in Charlotte and also some Spencer looks. Charlotte could look like Carole’s mother for example, but no childhood photos have surfaced of the MIddletons.
Charlotte resembles William as a child. That might change when she gets older, but right now if we look at pictures of William at the same age they look very similar, so I guess that would be the Spencer side since William did resemble Diana until the Windsor genes kicked in.
Put Charlotte’s photo next to a childhood photo of Sarah Chatto. Could be twins.
This! The “Royal Family” documentary has a short clip of Lady Sarah in school, at about Charlotte’s age, and I did a triple take because they’re nearly identical.
I think Sarah and her brother and her half sisters got the Snowdon genes and they predominate. Sarah and Charlotte when children had the same hairdo which is the photo used comparing them.Sarah has a stronger jaw line than charlotte.as I see it. Sarah is an Armstrong Jones in looks. I see strong middleton features in all three Wales children.
Yes that is who she looks like
Carole
https://images.hellomagazine.com/imagenes/celebrities/2013071813552/carole-middleton-biography-kate-pregnant/0-69-492/carole-middleton-little–a.jpg
Charlotte looked like adult Carole and Pippa, when she was 1-5, but now she is a copy of William, I think.
Charlotte is the only one who resembles William, the two boys look like Michael Middleton
We should not overlook basic genetics. I seriously do not wish anything bad upon those children, but the Windsor/Middleton genes offer a lot of narcissism, a lot of stupidity, a lot of stubbornness, depression, alcoholism, low empathy.
The Windsor genes also offer some artistic skill, some musical skill, some intelligence (not overwhelming).
I can see Charlotte as another Princess Margaret (but hope for more for her). I can see Louis as another figure of fragile masculine entitlement.
This is not the way. No one is doomed because of their parents’ genetics. That’s just a fancy way of pushing the ancient myth of blood inferiority/superiority. And how one is raised, and also other influences OUTSIDE the family, matter a ton.
This is harsh. No one can help their genetics. Mental illness and alcoholism are known to have a genetic predisposition. Intelligence is only partly inherited. Do you blame Meghan for how her father is? These are children.
My father is an alcoholic. I am not. I really wish the “if your parent is an alcoholic, you are nearly doomed to be too” thing would die.
Agreed. |Free will is underrated.
In reading the book, I think the most defining and traumatic thing that ever happened to Harry was his mother’s passing. His parents’ divorce was very hard on him too. His whole life would’ve been different if not for that. Though nobody’s life is perfect, William’s children are not doomed to repeat that exact same thing.
Isn’t Andrew the previous spare? That’s working well too.
I am sure the kids will grow up fine. Kate and William are able to devote so much time with them more than the average dual income parents who work.
When you have a live in nanny (or right next door) for all three school age kids then you are not spending that much time with your kids. Kate and William do not work or travel enough to warrant any extra help at this point and the likelihood that either of them spends the amount of time that regular parents spend with their kids is nil.
Spending more time than the Queen did isn’t a high bar.
Parents who both work are not necessarily bested by privileged royal family members like William and Kate. The parents both work and provide for their children and give them loving homes and do spend time with them.
I think for Harry, the 10 year career in the military where he was valued for who he was, was defining. Obviously intelligent, his personality and interest in other people was there all along. Along with being the spare and having the space to take a more objective view of the family and the system. If— Charlotte and Louis are permitted to try careers outside the royal family post college, this may be possible. If they are only ever shown their personal worth in relation to their family however, this seems like a very sad trajectory. I truly am sad for George. I hope Harry has shone a light for all of them though, on what is possible.
I am removing Katie Nichols from the conversation because she never tells the truth. She embellished every leak and had her fantasies about Harry once upon a time.
I don’t believe Charlotte or Louis will ever ascend the throne. Charles may reign for 10-15 years at best, and William will become King in his mid-50s. George will be an adult, possibly encouraged (cough) to marry and begin producing heirs. Charlotte and Louis will be in the same position as Harry and Archie are today. William and Kate should start preparing Charlotte and Louis to pursue an interest in philanthropy or an advanced college degree.
William is on track to become King after his father either abdicates or dies. He’s one hundred percent a monarchist. Even though his mental health is fragile, I don’t believe reality can rescue him. Kate sold her soul to this cause in 2011. Whatever the courtiers tell her to do, she will. My heart goes out to those children, and I pray the monarchy is either modernized to rid itself of Spare abuse or abolished in their lifetime.
England could still have a queen. If George decided not to marry and have a legitimate heir and passed away at 70 or so, Charlotte would be next up to bat. She would be in her 70s as well but legally the next in line.
We will tell with time what happens. If the cycle of abuse repeats itself then it will create an even more deep cut within the already frayed family bonds that exist.
What also just struck me, and seems so sinister, is that even if Charlotte and Louis found the wherewithal to get educated and have a career, the security is the golden handcuff. The threat of it being taken away is what would hang over their head (after Harry’s experience). They would need to hope they had the opportunities post exit to self fund that security. And the more that Kate and Will expose them as children to the rota and the media, the more vulnurable they become as get older to threats and the more reliant they will be on serious security protection. Its awful
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In a way, they have worked some things out. William can have his affairs as long as they don’t become “the love of his life” and Kate will put up with it as long as Will doesn’t stab her in the back in public.
The problem with the windsors is that they allow the media and staffers to interfere with what are essentially family affairs. And i don’t see william and kate breaking this circle. The wales children might enjoy a bit more privacy now, but how will that be when they start coming of age? In the time of social media? In any case, i am happy that archie and lilibet aren’t there to be offered up as their cover. Because the way harry and meghan were treated by that institution that was certainly the way it was going to be.
It might be easier on the kids if they come from a more stable base than Will and Harry had.
Also, there seems to be a sense of competitiveness and envy that is generational in the windsor family. Elizabeth vs Margaret
Charles vs Diana (and also andrew)
William vs Harry.
With it being known that kate was quite competitive with her sister too, i wonder what the wales kids are like amongst each other. Maybe it helps that george and charlotte are brother and sister instead of brother and brother or sister and sister.
@Chloe Didn’t Kate say that they were competitive when she visited the wheelchair rugby team?
@Equality All siblings are competitive, especially when they are the same gender, close in age and have similar interests.
@vivian: but in normal families, at a certain age, you outgrow that competitiveness.
@Vivian that is not true – it really depends on the child and the family dynamics – but there is a difference between being a little competitive at sports or something and for that competitiveness to spill over into every little interaction, which is how it seems to be with the Windsors.
But they have broken the ski trip photo wall, which is a good thing and I wonder how they did it. They are totally left alone on all their vacations, it’s a good thing for the kids, but what have they given up in return?
The tragedy was the loss of their mother, not that their parents did not stay together.
@Shazbot I’m not sure why or when that went away. They did release a picture or two from their ski trip several years ago and I remember there being some grumbling from some on the rota because I don’t think they were even told they were going on vacation or something. I wonder if William basically said “I don’t care, we’re not doing that, so you can either take what we do give you or go to hell?”
There is a discussion in either this post or another one about Charles and whether he is trying to correct the mistakes of his childhood. I think William is trying to correct those mistakes, but what he views as mistakes are the extreme press intrusion (okay I’ll give him that one) and his mother’s Bashir interview and his parents divorce.
So he has somehow figured out a way around the press intrusion, but I’m not sure how. I know we say its by dangling access to the kids in front of the RRs, but there still isn’t that much access (and I am not saying there should be more, just does having George at Wimbledon mean that much to the RRs?). Is it a combination of more access to the kids AND letting the press have a field day on Harry and Meghan?
There is all this talk of W&K making deals with the press and all that, but all I can really see of it is the free reign on H&M. Funeral aside, over the past 10 months or so we have seen the kids at Philip’s service, Easter, the Jubbly, George at Wimbledon, Charlotte at the commonwealth games, first day of school, christmas picture, and the christmas walk. I might be missing one or two but overall for almost a year timeframe thats less than one appearance a month, and some of those things were very brief appearances/walks in front of the press (Easter, first day of school, etc).
It’s certainly more than we saw of the kids 5 years ago, but I’m not sure its SO much more that it fits with the idea that the press has backed off the Wales bc now they have so much access to the kids, you know?
anyway just random thoughts as I drink my tea lol.
All the gloom and doom about Harry and William’s childhood. They were not trotted out as much as Kate and Will’s children nor was William blatantly shown to be more special in the PR. Plus. Harry and Will appeared to be having great times at the amusement parks and being with friends like other children do. How is it known that Keen and Bill will automatically have perfect family. Will and Kate could not even sort out that Louis should have been quietly taken backstage when he acted up and better yet, not bring an overtired child to a Jubilee event. And not to mention the way William treated his brother, he apparently thought it was “OK.”
LOL, well, to answer this part of your comment – “How is it known that Keen and Bill will automatically have perfect family.”
It is known because they tell us constantly, lol.
@Becks, seriously. W&K can smugly make all of the predictions they want now; their kids are still young enough that they can essentially make the decisions and call all of the shots. All three are still cute and fairly malleable.
But once those children get older, and their individual personalities emerge more, all bets are off. Absolutely *no way* can W&K control those kids once they’re teenagers, and even before that, the Cambridge kids have access to the internet which gives them the ability to read anything being said (or that was ever printed, for that matter) about their families, a problem that earlier generations never faced. Prior generations of the BRF could brainwash the heir and the spare in peace.
They’re going to make friends that W&K might not like, or have interests their parents don’t approve of, or they might just say “Fck this fishbowl lifestyle, I’m going off to live in privacy in Costa Rica” (or whatever— I have absolutely no idea why that was the first place that came to mind 😂). What if George is gay? Or falls in love with (gasp) a WOC?
I would bet my firstborn that at some point, they’ll all read Spare, once they’re old enough to know how to hide it from their parents. And once they do…well, no one can predict what the fallout will be, but I have to believe there will be some. (Especially if they’re at a particularly rebellious age when they read it.) It may seriously change how they view their parents forever, and permanently damage those relationships.
There are going to be challenges that previous monarchs and heirs never faced, and given what we know, I don’t have much trust in William to be reasonable and compromising when it comes to his children, because he’s never learned to act like that with ANYONE. And I have a feeling that in his mind, they’re his property, not their own people. Kate— who knows where she will even be or what her role will be years from now, or how much the family will try to phase her out as the kids get older.
Anyway, I feel sorry for all three of those children, and truly wish them all the best and hope they grow up as unscathed as possible. But in that family? Yikes.
Huh? Harry says the opposite is true about his childhood.
@tessa: i have to disagree with your first comment. Harry and william were trotted out far more times than the wales children. And if they weren’t trotted out there was a pap following them around. George, charlotte and louis are occasionally papped but far less than harry and william. And as for them being trotted out… well it makes sense for george. He IS the heir and needs to get used to being in public and having camera’s on him, as cruel as it may sound. So far they mostly brought him to events that are kid friendly.
Diana and Charles did have staged photo ops with them. The paparazzi is a different matter. George was caught in a park with a nanny by the paparazzi and unfortunately, I think this will be continued as they get older. And Will and Harry grew up pre Internet and social media so it is a different matter and era. So they did not have to worry about their images on Twitter, et all. George is too young to have to “get used to the public” IMO. The children were brought to a funeral and adult events.
The Wales children are trotted out less because their parents are the least busy royals in modern history. The kids average one pap occasion per month? That is better than their mom’s average. I do think they have a more “normal” childhood than other English royalty has in the past, but when they hit their teen years they may “break free” and show their true colors. I think George will be insufferable like his grandfather and father, but will abdicate if possible (maybe he’ll force himself to fall in love with a Catholic). Charlotte will very much follow in Princess Anne’s wake (wild child teen / young adult, responsible grown up), and Louis? Is the Andrew. His mom’s favorite, the one devoid of any true responsibility, the “trust fund baby” if you will. Louis will be bored and have too much money.
They had fun at amusement parks! Therefore they were a perfectly happy family and no abuse was happening behind the scenes, nope!
That is such a — I’ll be nice and say incredibly naive thing to think.
Like estranged couples, each tried to make the children happy under the circumstances. Harry did say he had an enjoyable childhood and so did William. They were not miserable 24/7 to put it very gently. They also did not live under the same roof after the separation so things may have been somewhat better. It is not naivete it is seeing the glass half full. Their mother died young so they have happy memories about her. Harry also describes how he had therapy and remembered the times with his mother.
Well said, Tessa
@Tessa — Charles absolutely did not try to make Harry happy. He abused him, and encouraged his staff and other son to abuse him too. You can have happy memories of the people who abused you — it’s what makes abuse so difficult to deal with. But glass half full-ing about an abusive situation is a way to cover up for abusers.
Those children are going to suffer the same fate as their parents. W&K might think they have things worked out for them, but they are not taking the press into consideration.
I think it will be a lot worse. Will seems to be a control freak and will criticize and be “upset” at his childrens’ choices of significant others.
Your right Tessa and the signs are already there. George looks shattered all the time, Louis has behaviour problems and WHAT is going on with Charlotte? I don’t know if it’s caught anyone else’s eyes, but why does she always have her fingers crossed? William is a media hog and loves to be shown in a positive light, but it’s becoming harder and Kate? Oh how she loves a photo op, even at prince Phillips funeral she couldn’t resist or at the Queen’s
William has untreated anger issues stemming from the tragic death of his mother. And there are plenty of examples that he gets physical. We don’t know if Kate or the kids have faced the physical anger, but there is no way he hasn’t lost his temper on them.
Kate is also a psychological mess and she has done nothing to stop George from being placed above her other two kids, as Diana tried to do.
Having two parents who are alive does not mean they will have a more stable upbringing.
@Nic also worth pointing out that it seems that Kate is the most important one in her own family. Is that because she was singled out as the one with the best chance of “marrying well” since she was William’s age, or was that always part of how she was raised – the oldest, therefore the most important, full stop. I feel like its sort of a combination of the two things?
But regardless it means that she thinks treating the oldest best is just normal and natural, regardless of proximity to the throne.
@becks1 kate was treated as a golden child similar to William and the fact that the whole Middleton family made catching William’s interest as a family endeavour adds to the whole lack of normalcy of that family. James being depressed despite living a comfortable life is very likely linked to Carole and Mike being not great parents and focusing more on Kate than the rest especially once she got into St Andrews.
Louis and Charlotte don’t really have well adjusted relatives to speak to once they are treated as inferior unless they can speak with Harry or perhaps Eugenie.
Exactly, they phrase “worked things out” sounds like these children are robots not people who might have their own opinions. The parents have worked out how they will control them …good luck
100% agree
Louis will be the new Harry
Charlotte will be the new Elizabeth R but will be married off to some chinless wonder and the papers will delight in her sorrows
I feel incredibly sorry for them
the media then are not letting them be themselves. Charlotte is nothing like the Queen and even looks more like Diana and Carole and was born practically a century after the Queen. She should have a career and be herself. I would like Louis to be like Harry and be strong and protect his family and set about his own path. And not like the “spin” of Harry as depicted by the DM and other outlets.
I admire your optimism, but these kids come from Middleton loins. The personification of a social-climbing dynasty. Kate wouldn’t let her kids stray from the path she and her mother have worked so hard to step upon. If anything, sometimes I think Kate is the one who is most strictest when it comes to her kids.
Charlotte is adorable, but I don’t see any Diana in her face. She seems a blend of Middleton/Windsor. Louie, all Middleton. It’s weird that both she and her brother George are already working royals. And the day they brought out poor Louis in shorts and kneesocks (!)n the middle of winter was really something.
@Ronaldinhio … I think Louis will be the new Andrew (could you ever imagine Harry putting his hand over Diana’s mouth to shut her up)? Kate will forever favor him because he looks most like her/a Middleton and he will be the ‘favorite’ overly indulged child.
@The Duchess
their daughter is going to be the Queen Consort of England. They have arrived, there’s nowhere higher to climb. The only thing they can do now is perhaps marry a royal from another country, so that their blood line is in 2 royal households. But for a blood princess, even that is a lateral move, not a climb. She can easily combine that with a career.
Not to mention that parenting is just tough. Even the best-intentioned parents make mistakes, and neither Khate nor William seem like they would invest the energy that parenting requires. As long as they keep choosing the monarchy they are not choosing their kids.
Unfortunately, we know that the Windsors have a real blind spot when it comes to thinking about the future. Okay, sure, for the sake of argument let’s accept that they have a totally normal, idyllic childhood right now. What about ten years from now? Twenty? What happens when George does or says something stupid like we all did at some point? What happens when George or Charlotte have a partner that the public doesn’t approve of? How is having a “normal” childhood going to prepare them to play the press game / be an unwilling participant in it? Without some kind of change in the invisible contract, it’s all just wishful thinking.
There are hundreds of years of history detailing how bad that family has been with raising kids. Starting from the Hanovers. (And that’s the families who didn’t murder their siblings which was prior to that)
Pretending that somehow this generation will do better is wishful thinking. They have already shown they prioritize their eldest child over the other two for no discernible reason. Neither William or George have a role in the government and so there is zero reason to do this to him.
Except they aren’t at an “ordinary” school and they are in the spotlight. How is having plenty of holidays, preparing them for real life or being ordinary? And, from pictures, Adelaide is not an “ordinary” cottage.
They are from a very wealthy family and will be wealthy adults. They are being raised as ordinary in that context. Adelaide may not be a normal cottage but it isn’t Buckingham palace.
But Adelaide Cottage is recent and they have an apartment at KP, Anmer Hall, and a cottage at Balmoral also. And aren’t there other properties that come with being Duke of Cornwall? Not to mention free run of several palaces whether living there full time or not. So not typical of an ordinary wealthy family either. And even “ordinary” wealthy families don’t holiday as much as W&K.
How? They are being raised just like any other aristocratic children except that their mother might be a little more involved than the queen was since she hardly does any work at all. We have all speculated that Bill doesn’t even live with them and how are we so convinced that they are living full time in this “cottage”? Because they told us so? Lol. I’m sick of pretending they are any different than any other mega rich privileged family. That is the narrative and talking points that the family, press, and RR have been pushing since day one and many people fall for it. They aren’t different and they certainly aren’t ordinary in any sense of the word.
This is all PR because of all of the bad press and how much ordinary citizens are struggling right now so they are feeling a little threatened which means they are sending out that mouthpieces to say, “No, no, don’t worry, we are just an ordinary family like you. We promise we don’t live a “Let them eat cake” lifestyle. Surprisingly a lot of people fall for it.
@equality: let’s not forget the frequent helicopter rides to beat traffic. I don’t know any ordinary family that does that
I’m really sick and tired of their “ordinary ” and “normal” upbringing according the PR.. let’s face it: the only ordinary person they interact with is their nanny and thus their only hope… they’re brought up as special, different from the rest of the peasants… do you really believe that their parents who demand differential treatment from everyone (Easter presents, anyone?) with their rigid behavior and insistence of rules, appearances and protocols (Louis and George wearing shorts in winter, George wearing a suit in a hot day at Wimbledon etc. ) are raising them ordinarily? And as far as the stable family environment is concerned, we don’t really know what goes behind closed doors. We all have our suspicions that they have separated and judging from the tidbits of the media, they both have pretty volatile characters. Not to mention Kate’s obvious mental struggles… the example set by their parents is problematic and unfortunately the apple never falls far from the tree…
An ordinary (prep) school, regular (mansion) cottage, (endless) bucket and spade holidays, teaching them to sail. Yep, just normal average kids lol.
With 24 hour security and a nanny.
Always interesting to watch the press acknowledge that Harry’s memoir has merit ( “No one wants the next generation to suffer as Harry has suffered…it’s not a pretty picture”) when they want to make a point about something, like the impeccable parenting skills of the Waleses.
When the book title was announced months ago they including Katie couldn’t get on the TV fast enough to deny that Harry was treated differently.
I noticed this as well!!
This is exactly what stood out to me as well, Wendy. Every week, there are more and more signs that the invisible contract is dissolving, and the media wants to sing like a canary.
Given that William is so entrenched in the heirachy I have no doubt that George already knows that he more important and is singled out for special treatment than his siblings.
This point is reinforced every time he is trotted out to attend a football match in a suit and tie in a box with world leaders.
Agree wholeheartedly!! And they don’t have any form of “normal” in their lives!! No one has four stately mansions or someone at their beck and call 24/7, like the Cambridge’s have. They also are not shuttled about in helicopters or in luxury vehicles being escorted by police.
Why Nicoll’s is trying to pass them off as “having figured it out” is absurd. You know those children see and hear their parents rows on a regular basis. A father with an alarming anger issues, a mother that is probably in a fit of inconsolable crying added with constantly having to phone her mother, her constant need of cosmetic surgery along with a possible eating disorder. To top it off they trout their children out when the RR’s demand it.
Nicholls isn’t fooling anyone and neither are Bulliam or KKKHate.
Expecting the Heir to understand this problem is ridiculous. Especially William. In my opinion it’d take a lot more self-reflection and willingness to receive criticism than he’s up for.
They aren’t setting the kids up for ‘the family job’; they are tying their children’s self-worth to the order in which they came into this world. One -has- to be more special than everyone else because that’s what a monarch is. And the person in charge of raising these kids is the ‘special’ one, who cannot possibly understand what it’s like to be anything else or why they’d want to.
But that person’s wife is an expert on putting babies in sports or something, so I’m sure it’ll be fine.
Agree. Having the heir and the heir’s wife say they have it all worked out is tone-deaf. It’s the spare’s perspective that matters. And they’ve bullied the spare out of the country and believe he’s brainwashed by therapy. None of that bodes well for having the heir-spare dynamic worked out for their children. They’ve never been the spare so how the hell would they know what that feels like.
This, all day long. Yes, the heir and his wife, in name only since she married a title, are equipped to raise one of their three children. The eldest. That is the beginning and the end of both of their lived experiences. Although, you would think they were both the youngest in their families, with the levels of entitled and lazy.
Yep.
I give Charles credit for trying to fix some of the problems of his childhood. (Not shipping his kids up to northern Scotland to freeze and cry, for starters.) But the fundamental ways the monarchy raises selfish, broken people has not changed.
I genuinely hope Will and Kate make life a little easier for their kids, but Will simply isn’t in a position to make any real changes. His own future depends on it not EVER changing.
Charles in many ways is a worse parent than his own parents. Especially the way he treated Harry, and later Harry’s wife. Charles may be been cold and cried but he treated his first wife horribly and now Harry and Meghan. I don’t give Charles credit, he only made things worse. He put Camilla first always. At least the parents did not let Charles as the heir in effect exile one of his siblings. William has his own dysfunction that unfortunately probably will carry over to his parenting.
Charles didn’t put Camilla first, he put himself first. He was much more interested in his romantic life than the life of his first wife and their children. Charles is a profoundly selfish man who thinks of himself as generous and caring. It’s a combination that allowed him to treat Harry and Meghan as he did not feel the slightest bit of remorse.
I think Charles is a great example. He ‘fixed’ the parts he hated, like the school thing. That was something he understood because it directly and negatively affected his life. But he was incapable of looking outside himself when dealing with his kids’ emotional needs. To a certain extent I think all parents make similar choices and mistakes, just because we’re not perfect. But it should be obvious to everyone that Charles did a bad job. And that being the monarch is a solo job so orienting all your children towards supporting the one who gets to be king is a recipe for perpetuating broken and dysfunctional family dynamics.
Agreeing to not send his children to school in Scotland was about it. I can’t help but compare how Andrew always advocated and made sure his children were treated with the respect he left was due to them as grandchildren of the monarch versus how Charles allowed staff to treat Harry, the son of a future monarch. Eugenie and Beatrice had a four bedroom apartment in St. James Palace while Harry was living in a basement somewhere or that small cottage. I bet no staff person would dare go to the queen to complain about Andrew’s children.
Will Charlotte have a say in her own life? It sounds like William gets to decide, and what happens to Charlotte if her plans differ from her father’s. He will probably go after her the same way his gone after Harry. It doesn’t sound like they’re raising Charlotte to have a life outside of the monarchy which is what they need to do. My money is on Charlotte writing her memoir one day picking up where uncle Harry left off to show how the dysfunction of that family continued.
I think the relationship between Wills and George is much like an abused child has with his abuser/parent. When George and Kate met Wills at Wimbledon last year there was video of Wills arriving separately and greeting some of the Wimbledon folks who were standing there with Kate and George. When Wills came to George it was so awkward. It seemed like they hadn’t seen each other in awhile and I think George put out his hand to shake his dad’s hand. I thought if he hadn’t seen him for awhile you’d think he’d hug him and if he just saw him at breakfast that morning he’d smile and say hi Dad. He rarely smiles when he is walking with Wills. Looks like he is terrified of him.
Not Kate’s hagiographer! 😂😂😂 They are so unserious even when it comes to their children.
So two things:
1) they can’t have it all “worked out” and have plans to treat them differently than William and Harry were treated without W&K acknowledging that the way William and Harry were raised was effed up, you know? If William is going to say “hey i’m going to raise my kids differently than the way I was raised” then the next part of that is “because the way I was raised and the disparity in treatment between Harry and me and the heir vs spare dynamic is messed up and toxic.” And I just don’t think William thinks it was/is. If he did, he would be much more understanding of Harry’s decision to walk away.
2) We’ve talked on here before about how the dynamic will play out given the different sibling set up with the Wales children, and that may be what kind of saves them. Charlotte is technically the spare; will she be treated as such or will Louis be “the spare” in the eyes of the press? George is the heir, Charlotte is the princess, and Louis is….well, Louis. So will he end up getting the spare treatment, or will Charlotte?
Also can we take a minute to laugh at her description of their vacations?? Are we really just pretending this family didn’t go to Jordan last year and they don’t go skiing in the alps every year and Mustique isn’t Kate’s favorite holiday destination?
Interesting idea. 3 kids rather than 2 could mean that the two spares can possibly bond together as spares or at least disperse some of the negativity. I’d like to think that these kids will be alright. The whole system is just so twisted and competitive though and nothing is ever as it seems. Family members who should be friends and have each other’s backs end up competing over who gets sacrificed in the press. Would love to see that cycle broken.
The main difference is that the wales kids haven’t lost their mother at a young age, which is hugely traumatic and requires therapy that William never received.
Otherwise William and Kate are both massively dysfunctional adults with major untreated psychological issues in a dysfunctional environment that perpetuates generational trauma and pits one child against the order based on birth order.
There is no way these kids get a functional upbringing unless the parents get significant treatment and make real changes about the sinister hierarchy set up within the family as well as the institution.
And the Middletons are just as bad because they crave to be a part of this dysfunctional system and they will not provide any normalcy for these kids.
And living with parents who are separated but acting otherwise in public will only add to everything.
Word.
Every single part of England’s system needs to recognize they have tossed all of their eggs in a basket that they don’t like, or want to pretend like they bow and curtsy to. I don’t even care that my high school English teacher is murdering me with her eyeballs, and red pen, for how I ended that sentence.
Game on, England. Peace be with you, blah, blah, blah.
Nicholl does not know what she is talking about. On the surface there is nothing so different about their childhoods up until this point, other than William and Harry went to boarding school. They are all trapped in the system and in a fish bowl. Harry said he had a very happy childhood and loads of fun. Nicholl does not know what it is like inside Kate and Will’s marriage and how much of that has seeped into the children’s lives. She really just makes everything up.
Charlotte and Louis will grow up to be jealous of Archie and Lili once they realize Archie and Lili are free to do whatever they want and don’t have to show up to all these ridiculous and stuffy royal events. I have no idea how Kate and William are navigating Harry and William’s rift and how they explain that to the kids. But they will start asking questions at some point and want to know about their uncle Harry and aunt Meghan and their cousins. And how are they going to explain that their American cousins can do whatever they want whenever they want? Not to mention Pippa’s kids are right there in the UK and the Wales kids will be able to immediately see their cousins are free to live the lives they want. Charlotte and Louis will eventually resent George’s position as heir, if not completely resent George. Royal siblings used to plot murder to usurp the heir back in the day. While that doesn’t happen anymore, the hierarchy still exists and that creates dysfunction for everyone. Kate and William want to pretend they are above the dysfunction but they aren’t, they’re right in the middle of it and their kids will suffer as a result just like William and Harry did.
You should be just as concerned for Harry’s children when they find out they have a grandfather, aunts, uncles and loads of cousins in the UK. Those kids are in for a less colorful life without any extended family.
Lol Vivian. I suppose you forgot when Meghan and Archie were completely ignored by Kate and the two of her children old enough to understand her edicts. Or when Archie’s grandfather did nothing when he was compared to a chimp, or when Charles and William sanctioned article after article about how “disrespectful” Lili’s name was, and the “concerns” about their children’s skin. Do you even read what you write?
First, the part about having a less colorful life without extended family is not true. Loads of people I know have very little extended family and have had lives that are just fine. Lots of these people also have family friends who took up the roles that cousins, aunts, and uncles might play. I myself have a huge extended family (over 40 cousins on one side!) but my parents didn’t live that close to them. Other than one set of cousins, I grew up with family friends whose members filled those roles for me. I can report that my life growing up was as colorful or mores than most.
Second, H&M’s kids will have contact with some of their extended family, just not all of them. And as someone who also had toxic relatives, their inclusion in your life is not exactly a good thing. Take my maternal grandfather (when he died, people went to his funeral just to make sure the rat b****** was dead, no joke). Our lives improved tremendously once my mother gave up trying to have a relationship with him. I don’t think H&M or their kids will benefit from a relationship with more than a few of the Windsors, so their lack of presence in their lives isn’t exactly a loss. Who needs a cold, self-centered grandfather who abuses and gaslights your parents around? How on earth would Archie and Lily benefit from a relationship with Snarles when he’s incapable of forming normal relationships?
Did you actually just say their life would be “less colorful” because they’re in California and not near the White family members who helped bully their parents away? Awkward choice of words.
Look, it’s a shame that they can’t live closer to their cousins. But they can’t. They are not safe in that country and the Monarchy won’t keep them safe. They will live in a diverse, vibrant place, make plenty of friends, have loving parents and more than enough financial security, and be free to choose their own paths.
They will have a rich life.
Less colorful? Lol, does Andrew provide the color? Presumably, there are cousins that Harry would like Archie and Lili to know. But, there’s also something called found family and we don’t know that the Sussex children won’t have that. In fact, I’m sure they will.
Less colorful? What? I grew up without much contact with my dad’s family simply because they lived in another country and we only got to see them once a year in the summer. Do I wish I could have seen them more growing up? Sure, but it didn’t impact my emotional development in any way and I was just fine growing up.
Meghan herself grew up as a child of divorce and without a lot of immediate family. She is doing just fine without her trashy older half siblings. (Her dad is another story). The Sussexes have lots of friends with kids close in age to theirs. They are doing just fine. The BRF has such complicated and dysfunctional relationships, Meghan and Harry are doing their kids a huge favor by raising them out of that bubble.
They have a grandfather and uncle in another country who disregarded their father and mother so much that they literally did not care whether they lived or died and pulled security after leaking their location.
These kids will have an extended family. It might not be through blood, but they’ll have an extended family.
Acting like blood ties trump all can be very very damaging.
Vivian, when I see someone comment as you do, I wonder why anyone would want the Sussex children to be used as metaphorical punching bags for the Wails children. They would be used as the scapegoats just as Harry was, except racism will be included. Why would anyone want that to be part of their childhood/lives?
Granddad could have flown over to see his grandchildren. Eugenie and h
Jack managed to visit.
“Less colourful life”?? The Sussex kids would be treated like the black sheep of the family. Lest we forget the Wails’s kids are A) Being brought up by parents who clearly loathe each other and live apart most of the time; and B) Inculcated with the same generational issues that haunted Harry and made Meghan suicidal, and both had therapy for the trauma they sustained whilst in the royal fold. They will actually have a more colourful life in California with parents who visibly and proudly display the love they have for each other and their children, who are deeply involved with public service and inclusivity, and will do their damndest to raise their kids to be kind, giving, and charitable instead of turning them into spoiled, elitest, racist little snots.
Archie and Lili will be able to read the book their father wrote and they will have a great understanding of what he did to protect them. Kids understand early on when certain relatives are poison and the Sussex kids will not have to worry about being placed below their cousins due to a stupid system.
They will end up pitying their cousins trapped in that mess because there is no way Charlotte and Louis escape the spare treatment. Edward to this day is still stuck worrying if he gets a title from his brother.
You made me laugh, I’ll give you that.
Since when have the Waleses expressed any affection for the Sussex children? I remember Peggington’s flippant “I already have a nephew” comment when Prince Archie was born. And I remember the photos of how deliberately Kkkhate went out of her way to ignore Meghan and newborn Archie at the polo match. And the Wales made sure the media was briefed about how delighted Will and Kkkhate were to snub Princess Lilibet’s birthday party.
So miss me with that crap about raising the kids around loving cousins. Their Black blood means the Wales kids are being taught to despise them and see them as beneath them.
Why expose innocent children to bigots, even if the bigots are relatives?
Those kids are called Archie and LILLIBET and those kids will be so grateful to their parents when they realise that their lives are happy, free and full of love, compared to the bear pit filled with petty jealousies and sheer bloody nastiness that they kept them away from
I doubt Charlotte and Louis will be jealous of Archie and Lilibet. They will have very little connection with them, just people they see at family funerals. I have a bunch of cousins and as I go about my daily life I don’t give them a thought, and I bet it’s the same with them. Neither will Archie and Lili wonder what’s going on with Louis or Charlotte or George.
Why do we have different expectations of these people than what we experience in our own lives?
Regular people don’t have their cousins covered by a nation’s media.
I worry about all children born into the world as it is. The Royal Fishbowl has its own special challenges. I fear for them all but in truth I don’t know them. Charlotte seems resilient and Louis seems to be full of beans, but that may not be true. Only time will tell. I wish them all well, and wish them all to do better than their parents did, swimming in that fishbowl with all those pirhanas.
Charlotte will be just fine. She won’t be known as the spare, but as the only daughter and future Princess Royal. She appears to ” get it”, takes the leadership position over her older brother and appears to have a maturity level better than most her age. It is Louis that they should be worried about. He’s a real little firecracker.
This is exactly the problem we’re talking about. The children have already been assigned “roles” and personality traits based on what has happened in front of the cameras. They are trapped.
I hope that will be the case, but as the only girl, she’s going to have attention on her appearance and probably scrutiny of her personal life that the boys won’t face. That’s bad in its own way.
I’m sorry but why would you assume that charlotte will be fine? I mean I hope so but the BM is grotesquely misogynistic and even a princess will not be immune. I genuinely shudder at how they will write about charlotte as she ages up. Seemingly benign articles will drip with deeply uncomfortable connotations, regardless of how she seems to “get it” and her being a princess royal. She will not be spared from the BM and the entrenched misogyny. No, she won’t get Meghan levels but she will get sexist commentary. There’s no amount of “getting it” that can prepare someone for that.
Charlotte will be fine. They will throw Lili under the bus to protect her. This is one of the sooo many reasons why Harry should mind his business and worry about Archie and Lili instead of worrying about those three kids that everyone will protect them at the expense of his own kids.
None of the Cambridge children (that we know of) are going to be fine growing up royal. They’ve been proving that for over 100 years.
Charlotte will be fine because she will be the only (acknowledged) Princess of her generation. There are no more princesses unless George and Louis have daughters.
Louis is the one who will get tossed under the bus. William never wanted to have him anyway and I actually don’t think William will want to serve Charlotte up as much as he and his dad served Harry up. He will (IMO) serve Louis up. So even though Charlotte is the technical Spare, it’s Louis who will get the Spare treatment.
She’s 7.
Lots of people thought Harry was fine until he said otherwise. Until she becomes an adult, we will have no idea how she is coping until she speaks at that time.
They are little children. Children about whom we don’t actually know anything. And I don’t think Charlotte will be “fine” unless Will and Kate throw everything they have at protecting her, considering the massive misogyny of the English press. They are rubbing their hands with glee, waiting until she hits puberty to tear her to bits.
Kate needs to be the center of attention, particularly with other females around. I don’t see her doing well when attention shifts to Charlotte, as it naturally will, when she gets older. She’s almost 8; in 5 years she’ll be 13, just entering her teen years, while Kate will be on the far side of 45. I bet there will be trouble for Charlotte in this situation, with Kate as her mother. After all, jealousy is the Windsor/Middleton way.
The Cambridge kids definitely have had a more stable upbringing than both William & Harry, and indeed Charles managed. It’s probably closer to what the late Queen had – relatively secluded and a tight family unit. But that didn’t really help Princess Margaret, who ended up with the same “Spare” dynamic.
It’ll be different for Charlotte and Louis, who’ll get the proper education that Margaret so resented missing out on. But it doesn’t solve the problem of what happens if they don’t fit the mould the media expects them sit in. That’s where they’ll have a challenge – when George is human and screws up, do they say “guess what, he’s human, so are we, don’t like it? Tough.” Or do they feed a “Charlotte/Louis is the royal rascal” story to the press?
I would not say for certain that the Wales children have a more stable upbringing. It is IMO too soon to tell.The spin is that they are the “ideal” family, and this is the facade of the family. How they get along every day is impossible to say. I think in many ways Will and Harry had a more stable upbringing, despite it all, Charles and Diana both had decided not to treat the heir as more “special.” And there were no photos of William being singled out to get gifts (exception was when the Queen Mother doted on William and ignored Harry). The images of George being singled out to take to games and getting gifts to me could mean trouble in the family dynamic down the road. The “instability” potentially with the Wales comes with the way Harry and Meghan were treated. How the children will react to that in future?
I was going to say that the more accurate comparison of the spare dynamic for the Wales’ kids is to the queen and her sister. Margaret never really got over not being able to marry who she wished. And, as a child, her father being aware of the thankless position of the spare (he himself was one), spoiled her terribly. Even in the most stable home, and W&K allegedly have their share of problems, it is truly toxic to treat one child as more important and more valuable than the others. And it only gets worse as they get older.
Given Bill’s reported temper, I’m not so sure the Wales’ kids are having a more stable upbringing than past generations. Different, yes. But a parent who thinks it’s ok to physically assault their uncle? How does he act at home? His temper has to impact their lives too.
Just because their parents aren’t divorced doesn’t mean it’s more stable. Harry has already mentioned William’s anger issues.
And parents who stay together for the sake of the kids end up making everything worse. Especially when it’s to preserve a public facade.
All these reporters are forgetting social media. Do none of them realize that very soon. Especially for George. That the kids classmates and friends are going to have camera phones. I’m sure the royal family are trying to not allow that to happen. But it is going to happen. And all the things that George gets up to is going to be documented. Whatever William and Kate try to do about it. And without Harry & Meaghan to throw under the bus. The tabloids are going to be extreme about it. For the clicks. How’s that going to look for Kate being a good mother.
I feel for these kids. They had no choice in being born into this family or in what order. And you’re right, George is already being singled out. Besides, Louis is aging out of the early years which means his mother will have no knowledge base to work from, right? lol
And I love that picture of Charlotte between her parents. She looks so embarrassed at the guffaws coming from William’s wife.
TOTALLY NORMAL CHILDHOOD! except for the time George warned his friend that he’d better watch out because George’s dad will be king …
Sorry, the display at the Jubilee parade debunks this. The Wales have shown time and time again that they really prioritize how things look, rather than how it feels to use Harry and Meghan’s term. All their cousins were moving around and playing with each other not sitting in the “good seats” in the front row. George, Charlotte and Louis had to stay in their priority seats and not mix. When W&H were growing up they didn’t stay with their family during balcony appearances according to rank, they hung out with their cousins. Rank is definitely important in the Wales’ home and they all know their place, except maybe Louis, but I am sure we will learn soon.
I think Kate Nichols is projecting, I doubt anyone is discussing the children with her, it’s just more perfect parents will and Kate they’re just like us propaganda. What she doesn’t seem to realise or is deliberately leaving out, is that it’s not just up to William and Kate. If the media need tension they will create it. Also it’s hilarious how Katie leaves out the holidays to the private island of mustique on the duke of Westminster’s private jet, the holidays to courcheval and Jordan. Or that lambrook isn’t a normal school. It’s an extremely expensive one with many acres of grounds. Also George is already aware of his status, separated at the Christmas cake photo op, having reportedly told another kid at school about his dad being the future king so…
In the midst of all this I do actually sorry for Harry and Meghan sometimes. The media clearly want one of them unalive. Also, their war with murdoch and rothermere will likely continue all through their kids formative years, kids murdoch press already don’t see as human. I’m glad it looks like from the documentary they do get to have a pretty normal life. But once they’re out and about… they aren’t going to treat them like they do Edward and Sophie’s kids. They’re going to intrude on their school life FOR SURE.
I would just like to say that all of these photos stream dysfunctional family, especially the balcony one
The picture of charlotte on the beach between her parents really stood out to me. Her face says over it while Kate does her gigantic fake laugh. I’m uncomfortable just seeing that fake laugh in photos. Imagine sitting next to it when you know from real experience that it’s not genuine.
Bench*
Scream not stream..
On the plus side, both parents are still alive and not openly warring with each other in the media. There doesn’t seem to be a Camilla in William’s life either. Just a bunch of shallow affairs (except Rose??)
William is DEEPLY emotionally invested in at least keeping the facade of a happy marriage/family. I bet you to this day he remains angry at Diana at not sucking it up and taking Charles’ adulterous ways because he believes if she did, she would still be alive.
That said, those kids are being raised in a household with a rage monster father and an eating disordered mean girl. They have probably witnessed and overheard knock down drag out fights between their parents. George and Louis are learning how to be disrespectful to women like Pa and Charlotte is probably already obsessing over her weight like Mummy.
They’ll probably develop panic disorders from being trotted out regularly like zoo animals to the public and the press. And sadly have no idea that their characters are already being developed by the press before they even have a chance to figure out who they are themselves.
Yeah, it’s going GREAT.
William could still meet a “Camilla”. It was not only Charles behavior re: Camilla, he was witnessed being emotionally abusive with public putdowns. As early as 1983 he pronounced, with his wife sitting next to him, that he needed two wives–this at a public banquet, Diana cringed. Diana was made of sterner stuff than Kate and did not put up with it and eventually left.
Harry didn’t complain about not having enough time to run around outdoors and play! That’s one of the few things about his childhood that sounded pretty good. So it’s not like learning to sail or playing on the beach is going to counter that for the Cambridge kids.
I do hope that the Cambridges consider their kids’ academic abilities when choosing schools for them later on, but that is later on, so who knows how that will go?
That pic with the little squirt’s hand over his mum’s mouth is so oddly satisfying lol. I can say my boys never did that as toddlers. Hushing up mommy? Um no.
@Kaiser said:
“In some sense, Nicholl is correct that the Wales kids’ childhoods are vastly different from Harry and William’s childhoods. Harry and William had parents going to war with each other in the media and at home….”
…………………………………………………………………………….
Um…… No…uh. The War of the Wales Part Deux is on like Donkey Kong! Their sycophants/co-conspirators in the britshidtmedia have been hinting at the loud drag-out fights these two have been having from within the first 5 years of their marriage. And its only gotten worse.
We’ve seen the infamous pointed finger wth a glimpse of the red angry face of BullyBoyWilly with the simultaneous cowering face of kkkHATE. And we’re told that “she gives as much as she gets” behind closed doors during their “screaming matches.”
We’ve also seen kkkHATE’s physical deterioration right before our eyes. The only thing we’ve NOT been told by the sycophants is that he’s physically abusive to her. And thats because they wouldnt dare!
HOWEVER, we can only surmise, given what we’ve learned in H’s memoir, Spare, that BullyBoyWilly is not averse to hitting women. Remember, he dragged his sorry arse over to the Sussex’s house, in anger, demanding to see M, only to learn she was in NY at the time. WHAT, pray tell, did that sorry excuse of a man have in mind, given that he took his frustration and anger out on H instead.
So yeah, the cambrats have been seeing their parents go at each other, just as BullyBoyWilly and H saw with their parents. Have you not seen the cowed look on the faces of those poor little mites?
Did you actually read the book? He did not go to the Sussex’s house “demanding” to see Meghan. He only wanted to talk to Harry. —
“ Willy asked for a meeting. He wanted to talk about everything, the whole rolling catastrophe. Just him and me, he said. As it happened, Meg was out of town, visiting girlfriends, so his timing was perfect. I invited him over.” — That’s what Harry said in his book
William also demanded that Harry “not tell Meg” about the altercation and she only found out when she saw his bruised and cut back while getting out of the shower.
It’s clear the Wails have a very caustic marriage. This is a dangerous environment in which to raise kids as it will habituate them to the idea that fighting, yelling and stony silences are the norm. The fact that their parents live apart much of the time must also be damaging — they don’t have good role models as parents and I predict those kids are going to be more than a handful as they grow up.
We just don’t know. Maybe the Wails home life is as wholesome as it looks. Maybe William and Keen fight all the time, maybe William rages, maybe they know they have to hide that dad doesn’t always live with them, maybe Keen spends her days exercising (or whatever one does to remain severely underweight).
Their home life could be perfect but every time the children appear in public as part of their parents’ engagements, every time George is placed in a head of state box with adults, every time their first day of the school year is filmed and distributed to the worldwide media, the ability to limit that media access and attention later is diminished just a bit more. William and Kate understood this 10 years ago and stood ready to battle both the press and courtiers. Something changed.
If the Wails’ home life is “as wholesome as it looks,” it’s as wholesome as a three-decker sauerkraut and toadstool sandwich with arsenic sauce. The mother has a severe eating disorder, the father has massive rage issues, they clearly hate each other, and they parade the children around to cover for it. That’s just what we know.
💯🤣😂
There’s another member of their family that the Waleses haven’t considered. The British media. The British media will expect to play a role in the upbringing of those kids. They will voice their disapproval of anything those kids do that don’t go according to script. The people the kids date, what they study at school, what hobbies they have, will be scrutinized and judged by the media. If the Windsors love is transactional and conditional, the media’s affection and approval is even worse. Kate only has media approval because they had someone else to hate instead of her. The media has Kate on a short rope–she’s acceptable as long as she remains slender and silent.
If those kids have their own voices, interests that extend beyond the narrow range of what’s acceptable (horses, country pursuits, the “right” sports), they will be fed to the wolves. If Charlotte is anything other than thin and pretty, her appearance will be judged mercilessly. If Louis is smarter or more charismatic than George, he will be forced to make himself lesser.
Social media will make their lives so much worse. Very soon, their friends, their dates, will be subject to scrutiny that’s even worse than what Harry experienced. Those ratchets will give opinions on the kids mistakes, poor performances, awkwardness. It will be even worse if the kids are talented–then they will be expected to excel at all costs.
My guess is that the Wales will cloister those kids and only expose them to upper class norms and opportunities, for all their talk about “normal kids.” At some point, the spotlight will be on the kids instead of their parents, and they have 2 parents who are prone to jealousy. Generational trauma continues. Which is exactly what the media wants–the Wales children aren’t people. They are performing hamsters who exist for the entertainment of the British public. They refuse their assigned roles at their peril.
The royals are in serious trouble. George is a cute kid, but it doesn’t look to me like he is going to get his father “child actor” good looks so good luck finding a suitable bride smitten enough to be willing to date an heir on the down low and let the paps sift through her dirty laundry like raccoons.
The other two have it even worse since they have no power or leverage, and the palace will be more than happy to trash their relationships if it will make the heir seem like the pick of the litter.
It would serve the racists right if the crown gets passed to the Sussexes if the Cambridges refuse to breed in captivity.
Your last sentence, @monlette, but me between the eyes! What happens if George, Charlotte and Louis all do not reproduce or have no living children? Would Archies’ first child be first in line?
The line goes to Harry and then Archie and Lili if the Wales kids don’t have any kids of their own.
Unless Charles somehow removes Harry, but it’s doubtful he will go that far. And if not Harry’s line then it goes to Andrew, so that is a worse option and unlikely why Charles is not messing with the line of succession.
Charles can’t mess with the line of succession. He doesn’t have that power. It would have to go through Parliament.
Its a fantastical fantasy to fantasize about H&M’s kids going anywhere near that poisoned chalice cult known as the BRF. Even if the entire cambridge/wales clan were to………become incapable/unable/unavailable (I do hope you recognize and appreciate all these pseudonyms) for whatever reason, it is my belief that H&M, as well as A and L themselves, will reject that cult in favor of the authentic life H&M will have created for themselves and their, by then, adult children
If that means immediate extraction of H and his heirs from the line of succession, given that H&M back in 2020 offered the BRF the opportunity to go ahead and take their titles and the cowards refused, then clearly, being removed from the line of succession will have no meaning to H&M and their kids.
Monlette, I don’t think we have to worry about Charlotte “breeding in captivity”. Wails will make sure she knows that it’s her duty to have children.
Well, at least this reporter is acknowledging Harry’s trauma. But she’s kidding herself otherwise.
William and Kate are ALL about appearances. On the balcony for the Jubbly flyover, George, Charlotte and Louis all should have been wearing ear protectors — but those might have spoiled the photos.
Poor little Louis should have been wearing long trousers for the Christmas Day church walk — but his parents had him in shorts and knee socks, because that’s what royal sons traditionally wore. On the same walk, Kate was wearing a hat and leather gloves, while her kids went hatless and gloveless.
George was forced to swelter in a suit at the Wimbledon’s men’s final, in a freaking heat wave.
William and Kate have figured out NOTHING. They will sacrifice their children to the monarchy and to a falsified image of the monarchy, just as Charles did.
We don’t REALLY know what goes on behind the scenes in Kate and William’s home and with their children. But @QuiteContrary your point about appearances is spot on. When they bring the kids out, I see a Mom and Dad who have children inappropriately dressed for the weather–bare knees on a cold winter day; no gloves/hats or scarves and George sweltering at Wimbledon with no breaks. We see kids forced to sit through events that are not age-appropriate. I still maintain that Charlotte and George were too young for the whole day funeral of QEII and Louis was too young for that stupid Jubbly concert. We see Louis disrespecting his mother putting his hand on her mouth, and shaking his finger in her face (at least the mystery of where he learned that has been solved thanks to SPARE.) We don’t see the mom and dad interacting happily with each other while a family unit; the cold stares, separate arrivals, and space between them is now commonplace. We don’t see the family acting very happy and relaxed TOGETHER at all. So no, I don’t think the Wails have this family life in the bag and are doing it any better than Chuck and Di.
There is a photo of them on the balcony from the jubbly where the whole family looks miserable, even the kids. And this is where they knew they had to put on a show for the public and even that facade could not be maintained for the full fifteen minute balcony appearance (it might even have been shorter since the Queen was clearly not doing well then)
The media know things are not “okay” behind the scenes with them but they will cover for them as long as there is more given to trash H and M. Eventually that will dry out.
So what’s the plan: when Louis gets bad press to cover for George, W&K will say “but remember when we took you to the beach”?
Exactly. Or when his wedding must be planned around his brother and father’s schedule of public appearances. Or when he and his spouse want a small private wedding but there’s a recession and his partners have recently received some bad press. Or when his brother is shy and not a natural at public appearances and goes inward and he is asked to do a public appearance because someone in the family must provide a photograph that day. Or the first time he moons his classmates as his mother allegedly did and the papers extort his parents and grandparents over it. Etc etc
Remember one of William’s comments before the summit, explaining why he was a part of it, in relation to his children.
The second comment was one of many regarding Harry the ‘spare’ to the sad little man.
William spoke of establishing conditions to ensure that the spare will not see themself as an equal.
In terms of stability, why does one of the children seem tense when they are trotted out to fulfil their contract with their media establishment?
An unhappy home environment is less emotional healthy than two separate existences due to divorce.
Less tension, friction and shouting….
At Christmas George was dressed as a mini-William.
A stark contrast to his siblings.
Despite the aspirations expressed in the fail, I suppose it seem like Louis.
I sincerely hope that I am wrong, and am misreading the obvious signs.
But some one has to suffer the pain of being lied about and be deliberately misunderstood to “create royalty in captivity”.
And by trotting the children out regularly, they are already setting an expectation with the British press and British public that the children are public figures with an exalted public role. That is not a genie that is easily put back in the bottle, and the Sussexes will not continue 5 years from now or even a decade from now to be daily news fodder. It is just an inevitability that the Wales will either feed the machine or fight it.
Kids are already overexposed so there is nothing to see
Obviously, it was a code orange alarm at Middleton manor at this line: his brother Prince William – who ‘made it very clear that the children are not his responsibility’.
Forget the heir and the spare dynamic – this article is all about trying to reinforce that the Cambridges are both involved in the parenting decisions (as opposed to Kate, her mother, and an army of nannies). Why, they even take their children on holidays! Together! Imagine that.
And the Middletons rallied around Kate because it *benefitted them directly.* James Middleton’s cake business got a full Tatler spread when he was not even 25. Pippa was interviewed by the telegraph before the wedding AND before her own forays into journalism etc. There’s no doubt party pieces got more attention. William helped buy the house the Middletons live in. There’s an endless list of things that the “spares” were given to assuage their fate – even Margaret. She was allowed to accept the The house on Mustique. Money to renovate it etc. What has gone on since the 90s is that the spares are expected to portray themselves as paupers and not “trade on their position.” Yet Harry seems to be the only one who took that seriously and was still criticized for it
God those pics of Keen with her mouth wide open fake laugh. Kind of understand Louis hand over her mouth a little better.
Unless William is willing to take on the British press when his children are teens and adults, none of this can be true. The destiny for Charlotte and Louis is very simple. they can become full time working members of the royal family and face a lifetime of public scrutiny and battles over the purse strings and housing and security. Or they enter the a cloistered infantalized “workforce” a la James Middleton. Or they enter the kind of employment for a certain kind of rich woman like Eugenie (and face a certain level of criticism for using their titles and connections). Or they attempt to enter into the other kind of employment available to rich kids with connections everywhere – commercial real estate, high end residential real estate, hedge funder (almost definitely would require too much work), real estate developer, and face endless accusations of using their titles, connections, etc. Royal observers and reporters of the non sycophantic variety felt that insistence on refusing to entertain any real option for Harry and Meghan was a missed opportunity to set a precedent now and get the public now used to working royal heirs. If they are preparing this kids to enter a modern workforce, even a highly connected one, then they will absolutely have to battle the media over it. If they aren’t, then we are in for more of the same.
Ditto.
By the time they are adults people might not care about the whole royal circus anymore, they may be lucky and just live quiet luxurious lives.
The Wales’ kids will have their dating lives scrutized more thanks to social media. Plus classmates can bully them by putting up compromising pictures of them on their pages.
This whole paragraph is hilarious:
“The royal expert said the family were enjoying a childhood which the brothers didn’t, adding: ‘I think when you look to the Cambridges and how they are raising their children, away from the spotlight, in pretty ordinary schools, in a regular cottage on the grounds of Windsor, having bucket and spade holidays and teaching them to sail on the broads in Norfolk….”
“pretty ordinary schools?” “regular cottage?” “grounds of Windsor?” “teaching them to sail?” None of these details depict ordinary. Very aristocratic at the very least- so is her point that they are being raised as ordinary aristocrats rather than royals? I think Diana was very aware of her son’s positions. She didn’t try to raise them as “ordinary” but tried to give them experiences that many “ordinary” people had so that they could relate to people outside of their rarefied and incestuous circle. It seems to me that William and Harry made a lot of public appearances when they were children.
They don’t have it worked out. How could they? They have stated no specific changes regarding their children’s treatment in public. And they are clearly still preferentially treat George since he was little. This is toxic for all their children’s development and self-worth.
Plus there is social media fully established now. Not only will they suffer at the hands of school yard abusers, but anonymous people everywhere. They should never touch social media, until they are strong adults. Otherwise it could be their undoing.
They are a mess, and unless they enforce boundaries now, it will be will and Harry 2.0. Little pitchers have big ears. They will know what their father does to Harry and what the Sr. Royals do to everyone else. Even if they have no social media, rhey can still read online the fakakta present.
Of course these kids would have a much happier childhood than William and Harry, there’s no comparison, they may grow up alright if their parents keep it together
I don’t t hink anybody has a perfect childhood. William and Harry were happy as children and there are photos to prove it. Diana would take them to theme parks and they had lots of friends. William and Harry also spent time with their cousins on both sides of the family. If the parents stay together but there is some acrimony, it would not be good either. The tragedy was losing their mother. I think had she lived they would have been raised with shared custody which does happen in families.
Lee, what is your definition of the parents keeping it together? The parents can’t keep it together enough in public to try and look like they like each other. Do you think that goes away when they’re out of the public eye? Let’s not create a fairytale here.
She doesn’t know how those kids are being raised anymore than we do. Are they being raised to think they are “better” than other people because of their blood? My guess is yes, although we don’t know for sure. Are they being raised to accept that George is inherently more important than the other two? My guess is yes. Are they being raised to believe the wife’s role is to turn a blind eye to her husband’s cheating? My guess is yes. Are they being raised to accept racism and find it amusing? My guess is yes. Are they being raised to accept that the heir can be an incandescent rage monsters and nobody can tell him “no”? My guess is yes. All of that is more important than what house they live in, or where they go on vacation. But we don’t have insight into all that, so nobody can say they are good or bad parents, although based on what little we do know of them, again, my guess is “yes” to all of that.
Are W&K allowed to stay out of public with the kids until coronation day?
I think it would be a good idea.
Then, get W&K some actual work but leave the kids out of it.
KCIII would be very wise to make a large donation from his personal wealth, I think $4M is a good number, to be divided to several longstanding proven charities helping UK.
Put out a quick official statement, and then shut up and stay out of the public eye for at min. 3 months. Silence, no planting garbage in the media, no plotting against H or M.
Go away.
4 million dollars is less than pocket change for them. It’s nothing. Try 400 million and then we’re getting somewhere.
@Isabelle
Here is a picture of the Queen mum as a child. Princess Charlotte is very much like her IMO. & Less Middleton-like.
https://www.historyofroyalwomen.com/elizabeth-bowes-lyon-2/elizabeth-bowes-lyon-from-lady-to-duchess/
If anything, Eugénie is a dead ringer for her. Charlotte resembles her father more at her age.
Charlotte’s squinty eyes look nothing like that side
I think Eugenie is the one who looks most like the Queen Mother. I see more of a resemblance to the Middleton side in Charlotte and also some Spencer looks. Charlotte could look like Carole’s mother for example, but no childhood photos have surfaced of the MIddletons.
Charlotte resembles William as a child. That might change when she gets older, but right now if we look at pictures of William at the same age they look very similar, so I guess that would be the Spencer side since William did resemble Diana until the Windsor genes kicked in.
Put Charlotte’s photo next to a childhood photo of Sarah Chatto. Could be twins.
This! The “Royal Family” documentary has a short clip of Lady Sarah in school, at about Charlotte’s age, and I did a triple take because they’re nearly identical.
I think Sarah and her brother and her half sisters got the Snowdon genes and they predominate. Sarah and Charlotte when children had the same hairdo which is the photo used comparing them.Sarah has a stronger jaw line than charlotte.as I see it. Sarah is an Armstrong Jones in looks. I see strong middleton features in all three Wales children.
Yes that is who she looks like
Carole
https://images.hellomagazine.com/imagenes/celebrities/2013071813552/carole-middleton-biography-kate-pregnant/0-69-492/carole-middleton-little–a.jpg
Charlotte looked like adult Carole and Pippa, when she was 1-5, but now she is a copy of William, I think.
Charlotte is the only one who resembles William, the two boys look like Michael Middleton
We should not overlook basic genetics. I seriously do not wish anything bad upon those children, but the Windsor/Middleton genes offer a lot of narcissism, a lot of stupidity, a lot of stubbornness, depression, alcoholism, low empathy.
The Windsor genes also offer some artistic skill, some musical skill, some intelligence (not overwhelming).
I can see Charlotte as another Princess Margaret (but hope for more for her). I can see Louis as another figure of fragile masculine entitlement.
This is not the way. No one is doomed because of their parents’ genetics. That’s just a fancy way of pushing the ancient myth of blood inferiority/superiority. And how one is raised, and also other influences OUTSIDE the family, matter a ton.
This is harsh. No one can help their genetics. Mental illness and alcoholism are known to have a genetic predisposition. Intelligence is only partly inherited. Do you blame Meghan for how her father is? These are children.
My father is an alcoholic. I am not. I really wish the “if your parent is an alcoholic, you are nearly doomed to be too” thing would die.
Agreed. |Free will is underrated.
In reading the book, I think the most defining and traumatic thing that ever happened to Harry was his mother’s passing. His parents’ divorce was very hard on him too. His whole life would’ve been different if not for that. Though nobody’s life is perfect, William’s children are not doomed to repeat that exact same thing.
Isn’t Andrew the previous spare? That’s working well too.
I am sure the kids will grow up fine. Kate and William are able to devote so much time with them more than the average dual income parents who work.
When you have a live in nanny (or right next door) for all three school age kids then you are not spending that much time with your kids. Kate and William do not work or travel enough to warrant any extra help at this point and the likelihood that either of them spends the amount of time that regular parents spend with their kids is nil.
Spending more time than the Queen did isn’t a high bar.
Parents who both work are not necessarily bested by privileged royal family members like William and Kate. The parents both work and provide for their children and give them loving homes and do spend time with them.
I think for Harry, the 10 year career in the military where he was valued for who he was, was defining. Obviously intelligent, his personality and interest in other people was there all along. Along with being the spare and having the space to take a more objective view of the family and the system. If— Charlotte and Louis are permitted to try careers outside the royal family post college, this may be possible. If they are only ever shown their personal worth in relation to their family however, this seems like a very sad trajectory. I truly am sad for George. I hope Harry has shone a light for all of them though, on what is possible.
I am removing Katie Nichols from the conversation because she never tells the truth. She embellished every leak and had her fantasies about Harry once upon a time.
I don’t believe Charlotte or Louis will ever ascend the throne. Charles may reign for 10-15 years at best, and William will become King in his mid-50s. George will be an adult, possibly encouraged (cough) to marry and begin producing heirs. Charlotte and Louis will be in the same position as Harry and Archie are today. William and Kate should start preparing Charlotte and Louis to pursue an interest in philanthropy or an advanced college degree.
William is on track to become King after his father either abdicates or dies. He’s one hundred percent a monarchist. Even though his mental health is fragile, I don’t believe reality can rescue him. Kate sold her soul to this cause in 2011. Whatever the courtiers tell her to do, she will. My heart goes out to those children, and I pray the monarchy is either modernized to rid itself of Spare abuse or abolished in their lifetime.
England could still have a queen. If George decided not to marry and have a legitimate heir and passed away at 70 or so, Charlotte would be next up to bat. She would be in her 70s as well but legally the next in line.
We will tell with time what happens. If the cycle of abuse repeats itself then it will create an even more deep cut within the already frayed family bonds that exist.
What also just struck me, and seems so sinister, is that even if Charlotte and Louis found the wherewithal to get educated and have a career, the security is the golden handcuff. The threat of it being taken away is what would hang over their head (after Harry’s experience). They would need to hope they had the opportunities post exit to self fund that security. And the more that Kate and Will expose them as children to the rota and the media, the more vulnurable they become as get older to threats and the more reliant they will be on serious security protection. Its awful